Claudia has left QVC

[BusyMum]

Nice to see you Argeybargy!

 

[Loveinamist]

Coincidence; http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ty-leave-boost-economy-says-Cameron-guru.html

 

[Elise]

I've worked for three multinational companies, and in all three I've seen numerous examples of women playing the maternity system to get the maximum possible paid time off, then resigning.

The two patterns most commonly seen would be women having 3 or 4 children in as many years, and coming back for just a matter of months in between each one (which would usually be filled with retraining and reinductions, so that they never actually got to do any real work before going off on the next maternity leave). Or, it would involve having the first child, taking the maximum possible time off, coming back for the minimum time permissible, then resigning.

I don't accept that most women are taken by surprise with how much they love their child and want to be with their child and thus find it harder to go back than expected - I think most reasonable, honest people should be able to forsee that having a child is a major responsibility and that there's a good chance balancing child-rearing and work is going to be pretty tough. Thus they have a fair idea in advance that they may not be going back. Even in the instances where women genuinely don't know until after the birth, why do they always take the maximum time permissible to come to the decision they won't return to work. Do they not feel this bond straight after the birth, but somehow magically it switches on around the time the paid leave runs out?

I also think the toll on people covering the work can be huge - I got stuck with a project management role that I was not ready for and could not cope with because the person meant to be doing the task went on maternity leave. I nearly had a breakdown over it, while they were having baby showers, coffee mornings and mailing in pictures of the new addition to the family. Having a child must a be a very rewarding and worthwhile thing to do, but it is the responsibility of the parents to make it work as a lifestyle choice - not everyone around them.

Fairest thing would be 6-12 months paid sabatical for all working adults, male or female, to do whatever they like (child-rearing, travel, whatever) once they've clocked up x amount of NI contributions. If you take time off before making the minimum contribution and don't come back to work afterwards to make it up, it comes out of your pension.

 

[Queen Bee]

Elise your proposal of 6 months paid leave for everyone to do with as they choose would bankrupt all businesses!

Maternity pay is funded by the government, not the company, its just over £100 per week, hardly enough to get excited over. There are very few people nowadays that get full or half pay from their company whilst on mat leave, yes maybe when mat leave was 12 weeks but not these days.

You can't tar everyone with the same brush, employees that return to work after having children are very valuable in any business and indeed to the economy. If you weren't prepared for the project you were given, then that was down to bad planning from the management, you should have been better prepped by them or someone else given the project.

Of course Mat leave can be a pain for some companies but so is sick leave and you can't stop people having that or just give everyone time off to match that given to those that are off ill.

You say that you were nearly having a breakdown whilst the new mothers were having baby showers, coffee mornings and mailing in pictures of the new addition to the family. i don't know any new mother that has a day that looks like that, most i know are lucky to be out of their pj's by 3pm! There is a lot more to caring for a newborn baby hence rules being in place to allow mothers time off work to do it.

Having a child must a be a very rewarding and worthwhile thing to do, but it is the responsibility of the parents to make it work as a lifestyle choice - not everyone around them.

Child rearing is the responsibility of society as a whole in my opinion. Just as time off to care for elderly relatives/spouses/next of kin is and there are laws to enable that for working adults too.

I don't have children (yet) and I'm now self employed but I don't see any problems with women having maternity leave and either returning or choosing not to return to work.

We all have choices, its up to us to exercise them.

 

[Elise]

There is nothing like the level of support for people acting as carers for elderly or sick relatives as there is for maternity leave.

Nor do most companies have a significant number of employees taking long term (i.e months worth) of sick leave at the same time, multiple times over a number of years as can happen with maternity leave, so that is not a valid comparison either.

And I don't see why the government can't fund sabbaticals if they can fund maternity leave, nursery vouchers, baby bonds and all the other stuff they seem to have bottomless pits for. Because allowing paid leave of any sort for one group (pregnant women/new mothers) but not for childless women, or for men is discrimination, whichever way you want to paint it. (And for the record, many large companies top up maternity pay beyond the legal minimum, which I think is another reason the system is abused).

As for me being prepped insufficiently to manage a project whilst a manager was off on maternity leave - no that's not the case. I am not employed as a project manager, plain and simple, nor am I at that grade or on the appropriate salary. It is not the role I was employed to do - I have another role. But someone who was employed to do that specific job (and who had only just started!) took time out to have a baby instead. They bailed out on their responsibility leaving someone else in the lurch.

No-one is saying that women should not be able to have children, or to decide not to come back to work. What people are saying on this thread is that the disingenous way in which it is often done is setting back the cause of womens rights and alienating colleagues, rather than garnering their support.

 

[rainbowj63]

Hear hear, I think we are forgetting the little mites whose mums are forced financially to return to work, before they are ready, I think its a sad case that society today and the same from the attitude expressed so judgmentally in this thread that we do not value childhood, whether its making it impossible for women / parents to be able to afford to stay home and care for their offspring (and it is a job - its the most important job in the world) if that is what they choose, those that do choose face horrendous financial struggles unless they are very fortunate and being judged for taking those choices. We dont value childhood in this society or in particular the very early precious years, it is evident from the poor childcare available, the lacking of funding in education and the erosion of the health services, its a very sad state of affairs if you ask me. Im glad Claudia and Sara chose to stay home with their children we should all have that choice as it is the next generation we are producing. This is from a mum whose four children and now in their twenties and evertime I left them when I returned to work after maternity leave it tore my heart out, so mostly worked nights to be awake with themduring the day..... I wish I had had the choice, and lastly can we not play nicely this thread has taken a very judgemental unpleasant tone.

 

[amn]

Hear hear, I think we are forgetting the little mites whose mums are forced financially to return to work, before they are ready, I think its a sad case that society today and the same from the attitude expressed so judgmentally in this thread that we do not value childhood, whether its making it impossible for women / parents to be able to afford to stay home and care for their offspring (and it is a job - its the most important job in the world) if that is what they choose, those that do choose face horrendous financial struggles unless they are very fortunate and being judged for taking those choices. We dont value childhood in this society or in particular the very early precious years, it is evident from the poor childcare available, the lacking of funding in education and the erosion of the health services, its a very sad state of affairs if you ask me. Im glad Claudia and Sara chose to stay home with their children we should all have that choice as it is the next generation we are producing. This is from a mum whose four children and now in their twenties and evertime I left them when I returned to work after maternity leave it tore my heart out, so mostly worked nights to be awake with themduring the day..... I wish I had had the choice, and lastly can we not play nicely this thread has taken a very judgemental unpleasant tone.

Well said.

I had intended to go back to work part time after my first child was born, but he was born with problems and when he was 5 months old we were told he had a rare genetic condition and would always be disabled, so I wasn't able to go back to work, to be honest it was the last thing on my mind.

I got a part time job when he was older and had started at school. When I had my second child I did go back (again part time), but after a couple of years of juggling me & Himself decided that I should give it up and stay at home with the children - what I was earning from the part time job was negligible, especially after we'd paid for childcare and stuff and we felt me being around for them was more important. We made the decision to have the children so we didn't feel it was right to pay someone else to look after them.

Himself isn't in some well paid high flying career, we have a mortgage to pay and all the usual stuff, I obviously earn nothing now, I get no handouts and we don't make a fuss - and while we're not on the breadline we do have to juggle the pennies sometimes, and yes it can be a struggle, but I feel lucky that I'm able to be with the kids, so that's the pay off.

And while being a housewife and mum might not be splitting the atom or chiselling at the coalface by hand it certainly is a job, albeit unpaid, it is to me anyway, and I work hard at it!

 

[Akimbo]

I "bailed" on my job. When my second child reached 4 I jot a job with the local health authority in a senior post, with more resposibility and lower pay than I'd earned when I first went on maternity leave 6 years earlier. Having no family locally and a husband frequently working abroad it was stressful beyond belief; dreading phone calls from the school to say a child was ill. I missed DD's first day in reception and forked out a fortune in after school and holiday childcare. I was expected to attend informal meetings in the evening across the county and inspite of the lipservice my boss paid, saying I could be flexible in my hours to manage my family, the reality was a climate of disapproval and mistrust. After 3 years I resigned. I'm a competent and intelligent and conscientious employee but I was better off financially working 17 hours a week at M&S than I was in a stressful full-time post after I'd paid for chilcare. The tragedy is that my knowledge and abilities and those of similar women with family commitments is lost to the employment market. I wish I'd never taken the job because the children since I left work have benefitted from my being at home, even now they're in their teens. Yes I get bored being at home and if had two incomes we'd live in a bigger house but some things are more important.
It saddens me that many of my children's friends spend so little time with their parents; but I am quite envious of those with grandparents and aunties locally who can do the school run if the mum is ill or can have the children stay overnight once in a while.

Jude xx

 

[WildRose]

Well said.

I had intended to go back to work part time after my first child was born, but he was born with problems and when he was 5 months old we were told he had a rare genetic condition and would always be disabled, so I wasn't able to go back to work, to be honest it was the last thing on my mind.

I got a part time job when he was older and had started at school. When I had my second child I did go back (again part time), but after a couple of years of juggling me & Himself decided that I should give it up and stay at home with the children - what I was earning from the part time job was negligible, especially after we'd paid for childcare and stuff and we felt me being around for them was more important. We made the decision to have the children so we didn't feel it was right to pay someone else to look after them.

Himself isn't in some well paid high flying career, we have a mortgage to pay and all the usual stuff, I obviously earn nothing now, I get no handouts and we don't make a fuss - and while we're not on the breadline we do have to juggle the pennies sometimes, and yes it can be a struggle, but I feel lucky that I'm able to be with the kids, so that's the pay off.

And while being a housewife and mum might not be splitting the atom or chiselling at the coalface by hand it certainly is a job, albeit unpaid, it is to me anyway, and I work hard at it!

I find it very sad that people belittle just how much value a mother/housewife has. You are bringing up another generation of people, who in turn will do the same. You are doing the most important job ever as your values, ethics and morals are being passed on ... and from them to another generation maybe. I think being a mother is the most important job

 

[silversequin]

if nobody had any children then where would the next generation of tax payers come from? Aside from this cynical way of viewing parenthood I also feel that by raising a child into adult hood who is now a qualified nurse and making a good contribution to socierty is proof positive of the value of being a mum.

I do agree that some women play the system but then some MPs fiddled their expenses, some business people dodge taxes, some people fiddle their benefits, some people inflate insurance claims, that is human behaviour,there will always be chancers.

 

[amn]

[/COLOR]



I find it very sad that people belittle just how much value a mother/housewife has. You are bringing up another generation of people, who in turn will do the same. You are doing the most important job ever as your values, ethics and morals are being passed on ... and from them to another generation maybe. I think being a mother is the most important job

People do though, the people I used to work with couldn't see why I'd want to do it.

 

[louise66]

Actually i might suggest that to charlie Bears!

Then we'll deffo see a Burly bear: they'll see you as a potential customer!