Random musings and general banter.

[cheeky chappie]

I always thought that shopping telly should be enjoyable to watch - I know that sometimes Rob and I would push that as far as it would go, but we really wanted people to enjoy the shows and to have a laugh. Though that's probably not the best metric in a business measuring sales.

Would you do Rob's YT talk show if it came back for a second series/season?

 

[GrantB]

Thanks for the insights @GrantB and for taking the time on a Sunday, it's appreciated!

If you can say... Did you ever get commission on sales, or bonus on achieving set targets or metrics on any items? Or just a set appearance rate. Were you paid the same for every show/appearance, or could it vary depending on the item value/margin or sales?

And if I can be really cheeky, was it well-paid, compared to non-TV jobs or other industries? I presume you did it for a reason, maybe for the media/live experience and line of work, and not just the money?

We've had a bit of a debate here whether 'tv' meant it is well or better paid, as most TV people in front of camera generally are, compared to 'average', or was it more like being paid as a 'contractor' or consultant presenter who just happens to present on TV. And shopping TV is a bit different to regular TV. (Also, never understood why they didn't show normal TV ads like ITV unless it was prohibited under TV/broadcast regulations for some reason. Can't remember if the IW on ITV lates had adverts interspersed).

Did you ever do demos/present at trade shows/fairs or conferences on trade stands? I've done a tiny bit of that, enjoyed meeting people and talking about stuff!

P.S. If you go to the graveyard Ideal World thread here, I said I thought you reminded me a bit of the comedian Alastair Beckett-King, if you know him, especially when you had the longer ponytail?!

Anyway, thanks for coming on the forum and saying hi and sharing the info. Best wishes in your future endeavours, etc.

Hello, you're welcome!

I never worked on commission or incentives. For me and guests directly booked by Ideal World there was an appearance fee. There was an amount for the first hour and then a lower amount for every other hour that day. There was also a set amount for "Pick of the Days" too, as you'd do 7 hours over the course of two days.

As I was driving down from Manchester, coming down for only one show a day really wasn't worth it. But, if you lived closer and could pick up several hours in a day, I'd say it would be quite a money spinner! For me, even coming down for several shows across a few days wasn't quite the wealth-builder you're imagining; with hotel costs, fuel, eating (have you ever tried catering for yourself in a Travelodge??). I wasn't exactly wealthy, but it put a few extra quid in my bank.

However, If you were there to represent a specific brand (which I never did) you could earn quite a lot more... several hundred pounds an hour if you were good enough at negotiating with whichever brand you were employed by, according to some anecdotes shared in the car park!

For me, the real reason to do it was because I enjoyed it; when I went back the last time, I'd relocated for a job in Hertfordshire. I didn't have much to do in the evenings (no real friends or family in the area) so I'd finish work, jump in the car and head to the studios to do a show or two! I found going live sharpened my mind, and it was an opportunity to tell a few jokes, share a few anecdotes and stay fresh!

I never did any trade shows or live shows other than standup ages ago... the fact that I'm as wildly famous as I am tells you how well that went!

Would you do Rob's YT talk show if it came back for a second series/season?

Maybe. It was nice to hang out with Rob away from Peterborough! I can't see it happening any time soon just because from what I've heard, he's busy with other projects, but again... never say 'never'!

 

[Herring]

Hello, you're welcome!

Nice to see you post here Grant - what on earth brought you here? Were you Googling your own name? I can't imagine this forum is very popular with people working in shopping TV!

I will say that, as I work in tech media, I did 'enjoy' the tech segments presented by you. You rarely made me wince, cringe, or want to throw something at my TV. In fact, there were a few occasions you did the unthinkable and mentioned drawbacks to products which was very refreshing. Honesty on shopping TV - who'd have thunk it.

In some ways, your presenting style is a lot more QVC-esque than the "gosh, wow, this awful cheap no-brand budget Android tablet is stunning, amazing, does everything those fruit-name tablets costing £900 can do… check out your baskets" routine Janice and Peter V would do. How familiar with their routines were you, and was there a conscious decision to not emulate them?

As for presenters, I've no doubt most of them are nice enough in real life. You have to be passably nice to get on in that industry. I've some personal friends who've met Peter Simon and all have said he's an absolute star, and has the ability to make everyone he meets feel like they're the most important person he's met that day. His selling techniques are highly questionable (but they clearly if unfathomably work) but he sounds genuinely nice off-screen.

I don't want ask anything that might screw you over, put you in an uncomfortable position, or ruin friendships, so more generally speaking, a few things I've always wondered:

• Are all products liked/considered life-changing by the on-screen talent? I (like to) imagine some come in to work and moan "FFS, I've got to sell THAT tat again?"

• Who decided what you wore on-screen? Were there rules (aside from obvious no brand names, etc) abut what you could come in? "Gens wearing blue, so don't clash", etc?

• Since IW "experts" were jacks of all trades (and rarely master of any) were there any other types of shows you would like to have had a crack at 'experting' on? Were you ever asked/invited to? Your sardonic humour would've been great on a carpet washer segment when (as they almost always do) go wrong at some point.

• What was your perception of selly telly before you joined? Had you watched IW? What did you friends/family think about you bring on TV?

Thanks!

 

[Deleted member 21838]

I would be very interested in Grant’s view on the latter years of the channel? Why (if he knows) did tech disappear? Was he still a viewer after he left, and if so, like many of us, could he see the writing was on the wall? Does he think shopping television has had (or will have) its day? Is it a format no longer relevant for long-term retail survival?

 

[Herring]

Shoot, I forgot to ask if Howard mentioned his bowels in conversation as often off-screen as he did on-screen…

 

[Deleted member 21838]

I always found him fairly unwholesome overall.

 

[GrantB]

Nice to see you post here Grant - what on earth brought you here? Were you Googling your own name? I can't imagine this forum is very popular with people working in shopping TV!

I will say that, as I work in tech media, I did 'enjoy' the tech segments presented by you. You rarely made me wince, cringe, or want to throw something at my TV. In fact, there were a few occasions you did the unthinkable and mentioned drawbacks to products which was very refreshing. Honesty on shopping TV - who'd have thunk it.

In some ways, your presenting style is a lot more QVC-esque than the "gosh, wow, this awful cheap no-brand budget Android tablet is stunning, amazing, does everything those fruit-name tablets costing £900 can do… check out your baskets" routine Janice and Peter V would do. How familiar with their routines were you, and was there a conscious decision to not emulate them?

As for presenters, I've no doubt most of them are nice enough in real life. You have to be passably nice to get on in that industry. I've some personal friends who've met Peter Simon and all have said he's an absolute star, and has the ability to make everyone he meets feel like they're the most important person he's met that day. His selling techniques are highly questionable (but they clearly if unfathomably work) but he sounds genuinely nice off-screen.

I don't want ask anything that might screw you over, put you in an uncomfortable position, or ruin friendships, so more generally speaking, a few things I've always wondered:

• Are all products liked/considered life-changing by the on-screen talent? I (like to) imagine some come in to work and moan "FFS, I've got to sell THAT tat again?"

• Who decided what you wore on-screen? Were there rules (aside from obvious no brand names, etc) abut what you could come in? "Gens wearing blue, so don't clash", etc?

• Since IW "experts" were jacks of all trades (and rarely master of any) were there any other types of shows you would like to have had a crack at 'experting' on? Were you ever asked/invited to? Your sardonic humour would've been great on a carpet washer segment when (as they almost always do) go wrong at some point.

• What was your perception of selly telly before you joined? Had you watched IW? What did you friends/family think about you bring on TV?

Thanks!

Hello again!

So I can't speak for anyone else, obviously... but I will say that I ordered quite a few things from Ideal World when I worked there; still very happy with my Boneco fan, mattress and Ingenio pans!

Again, I know it won't be a popular thing to say here, but it's a shop... no fishmonger hangs out of the door yelling "My fish stinks!" My example is; I never owned the £39 Android phone that IW sold, I wouldn't have ever swapped my phone for one, and I never certainly wouldn't have ever tried to sell it as being as good as an iPhone or Samsung.... but... for less than 5% of what my phone cost, here was this thing that had the Google Assistant and Navigation and could play YouTube without stuttering. Waxing lyrical about that wasn't hard for me!

Clothing - hmm... well I always took a few different choices, but no-one ever told me what to wear - which probably explains some of the more questionable fashion choices I made.

I never really got offered products from other categories, probably because on my first shows on the Deal Channel (remember that?) I did some cleaning products... aaaaaaaand... messed it right up! I don't think the world needed to see 'Chef Grant' struggling with pans when back then I could've burnt a salad!

I remember watching Shop!, Ideal World and QVC as a kid and thinking it was a cool idea... but I thought as the internet became more popular it would've faded away. When I was a student, we'd sometimes sit around watching Bid and Price Drop just because they were, at times, very entertaining, so then, years later when the opportunity came along, I thought "maybe I can have fun with this" and that's exactly what I tried to do. I watched a lot of IW before I screen-tested and I think it paid off.

Friends and family had a variety of reactions to it all - some friends knew me back in the days when I was doing 'edgy' standup comedy so they thought it was a very strange choice for me! My family were supportive - Grandma loved to tune in and watch, telling everyone that I was on the telly.

For me, I'd take the opportunity to do something like it again - but I'll always think there's space for it to be more entertaining. I think there's a lot of products that really benefit from being demonstrated on screen... but it's got to be fun for the audience. Modern platforms that allow for live-streaming offer more engagement and interaction, and I think that's one direction I'd go in if I were in charge.

Shopping TV will in one way or another always exist... the next iteration of it seems to be influencers on TikTok and Instagram... who knows what comes next?

 

[Jazzydrury]

I remember that £39 pound phone, and for a preteens first phone, or maybe an elderly member of your family who wanted something simple then it would have been a winner

 

[Muttley]

That ridiculous idea again - QVC tries that with scent - that, apparently, I've been 'stopped in the street and asked where I got that gorgeous scent from'.

This idea might be credible in any country other than Britain. We studiously avoid interacting with one another unless we have to: the idea that one British person might be so forward and in-your-face as to actually stop a stranger going about their business in the street and demand to know where they bought a particular scent, or item of clothing, is about the most ludicrous, unbelievable thing any presenter could say.

That's never happened to me. But I have been asked (twice) by strangers what cocktail I'm drinking cos it looked so nice. But that was on holiday where its acceptable to approach a stranger and ask a question like this!

 

[PhaedrusR]

For me, even coming down for several shows across a few days wasn't quite the wealth-builder you're imagining; with hotel costs, fuel, eating (have you ever tried catering for yourself in a Travelodge??). I wasn't exactly wealthy, but it put a few extra quid in my bank.

However, If you were there to represent a specific brand (which I never did) you could earn quite a lot more... several hundred pounds an hour if you were good enough at negotiating with whichever brand you were employed by, according to some anecdotes shared in the car park!

Thanks again. Hope you claimed all your working expenses at IW back as tax expenses
Afaik, travel, fuel, meals, whilst working away from usual place of work, on assignment, are all expenses that can be reclaimed against your tax on your self-assessment or via your company accounts.

Clearly @GrantB you have a 'performing' bug in you, as you did comedy and other presenting prior also. Do you have other outlets for 'acting', AmDram or briefings at work, etc. Reckon we'll see you pop up somewhere as an SA or theatre... Pantomime this year?!

Tech android: I ended up buying the Wileyfox Swift 2X for a stupid low price to get rid, from the IW eBay resale channel, an ex-studio one but it was brand new, cellophane screen protector intact, for a third, far less than the already reasonable £149/£199 it had been sold for on IW. And it was excellent at the time, octacore 2Ghz, android 8.1 oreo good at the time, lightweight, good battery life, performance, 4G, GPS, NFC, fingerprint reader. Wileyfox was a cool London design brand, made in China, later defunct and sold to STK (Santok) before going kaput. Still have one as a backup emergency phone and for travelling or when don't want to risk losing best phone!

I think RobL or PeterV said they had a Swift 2X (not the 2 lower model) one, when IW were selling the cheaper Swift or the STK ones and said they'd replace their fruit phone/contract as it did nearly everything a fruit phone did! If I believe what they said. I liked it. I only upgraded to get 5G!

 

[Herring]

Again, I know it won't be a popular thing to say here, but it's a shop... no fishmonger hangs out of the door yelling "My fish stinks!"

They don't, but IW doesn't act like a shop does it? It acts like a dodgy market stall staffed by largely unscrupulous pressure-sellers.

Brick and mortar stores (and indeed most reputable online retailers) don't mislead customers about the provenience, origin, or value of products in the manner that selly telly presenters do. I'm yet to walk in to Argos and be harangued by a sales person about a £39 watch being some kind of prestigious heirloom actually worth £999 so I must put it on the home insurance, etc.

I'll be sure to pop back and retract my claims if I do ever hear a fishmonger screaming "EVEN IF U DON'T EAT FISH YOU'LL JUST BUY THIS COD BECAUSE AT THIS PRICE IT'S PRACTICALLY A GIVEAWAY!! ONCE IT'S SOLD OUT, IT'S GONE! BOOK PRICE ON THIS FISH, HAND CAUGHT OFF THE COAST OF ATLANTIS, IS A THOUSAND POUNDS!! YOURS FOR £2.50 A KILO AS AN INTRODUCTORY PRICE!!"

Granted (heh) you rarely did that schtick but I find it (very) hard to believe no-one involved is in any way aware of the absurdity of their presentation.

 

[Deleted member 21838]

Nobody would expect any retailer to downplay their goods. The difference with Ideal World and most other shopping television channels is the hysterical exaggeration of the quality of them. In particular with things like watches. Unrealistic (that‘s putting it politely) RRPs. continually quoted throughout a presentation to drive home to the punter what a great deal this £5.99 timepiece is compared to its £5999 recommended selling price. Gross hyperbole for the sake of effect in the point I make, but it emphasises the barrow boy mentality of some if not most of the players in the market over the years. And with the ASA just offering ‘tellings off‘ as punishment for these types of transgressions, there is absolutely no incentive whatsoever to clean up their collective acts, is there?

 

[cheeky chappie]

Shopping TV will in one way or another always exist... the next iteration of it seems to be influencers on TikTok and Instagram... who knows what comes next?

I think this is a good point and yes, people promoting and/or selling products via various platforms will obviously continue, as you say influencers and the like. However I'd assert for the likes of Shop Extra (and probably others) and their style of production delivered over traditional tv channels, the writing's on the wall. Tbh it would probably still be on the wall albeit to a slower extent even if the dubious stuff was omitted and the product range increased. Maybe not the best analogy but a bit like the reduction in people watching tv in a 'sit down / linear' fashion due to catch-up and streaming options.

When you look at something like Shop Extra and stop and think about it, you realise how dated its approach is.

 

[User 23988]

As you say they may well be totally different off screen,but in the dieing days of Ideal World,non of the current Shop Extra tat sellers did themselves any favours.
TJC is already being dragged down to smut and shouting(people never learn)
Back to the four stooges on shop extra they were the wrong people to launch a new shopping channel,simply because many like myself will never buy anything from them.
IW went bust but a few days later they were having a party with not a care in the world
The words shallow and uncaring with no concern for others spring to mind!

 

[Deleted member 21838]

As has been said, selling goods via a television style feed. linked to social media platform is probably going to be the long-term future for the market. The future most definitely isn’t what channel is like Shop Extra are offering. Totally geared towards promoting the old fashioned values of yesteryear, along with the service of the past, and in the very worst ways. Focusing often on ordering by telephone, which a lot of younger people don’t want to do anymore. And with delivery very much in their control, rather than the customer’s – which again would be completely alien to anybody much under 40, used to having an active control over what they buy post purchase.

 

[PhaedrusR]

Hello again!

So I can't speak for anyone else, obviously... but I will say that I ordered quite a few things from Ideal World when I worked there; still very happy with my Boneco fan, mattress and Ingenio pans!

Again, I know it won't be a popular thing to say here, but it's a shop... no fishmonger hangs out of the door yelling "My fish stinks!" My example is; I never owned the £39 Android phone that IW sold, I wouldn't have ever swapped my phone for one, and I never certainly wouldn't have ever tried to sell it as being as good as an iPhone or Samsung.... but... for less than 5% of what my phone cost, here was this thing that had the Google Assistant and Navigation and could play YouTube without stuttering. Waxing lyrical about that wasn't hard for me!

Clothing - hmm... well I always took a few different choices, but no-one ever told me what to wear - which probably explains some of the more questionable fashion choices I made.

I never really got offered products from other categories, probably because on my first shows on the Deal Channel (remember that?) I did some cleaning products... aaaaaaaand... messed it right up! I don't think the world needed to see 'Chef Grant' struggling with pans when back then I could've burnt a salad!

I remember watching Shop!, Ideal World and QVC as a kid and thinking it was a cool idea... but I thought as the internet became more popular it would've faded away. When I was a student, we'd sometimes sit around watching Bid and Price Drop just because they were, at times, very entertaining, so then, years later when the opportunity came along, I thought "maybe I can have fun with this" and that's exactly what I tried to do. I watched a lot of IW before I screen-tested and I think it paid off.

Friends and family had a variety of reactions to it all - some friends knew me back in the days when I was doing 'edgy' standup comedy so they thought it was a very strange choice for me! My family were supportive - Grandma loved to tune in and watch, telling everyone that I was on the telly.

For me, I'd take the opportunity to do something like it again - but I'll always think there's space for it to be more entertaining. I think there's a lot of products that really benefit from being demonstrated on screen... but it's got to be fun for the audience. Modern platforms that allow for live-streaming offer more engagement and interaction, and I think that's one direction I'd go in if I were in charge.

Shopping TV will in one way or another always exist... the next iteration of it seems to be influencers on TikTok and Instagram... who knows what comes next?

What mattress did you get? Can I get a review if it's memory foam related, as thinking of trying one of those Emma/Tempur/Dormeo or hybrid type ones next.

The Tefal Ingenio set was nicely designed, but I thought the pricing of over £120+ or more was way over the top.

Hope you got a staff discount.

 

[cheeky chappie]

TJC is already being dragged down to smut and shouting(people never learn)

When it comes to those presenters, surely the conclusion we have to reach is they shift product? Why else would they be hired. As we've touched on before, in the world of sales, if someone's shifting product they're a positive asset to the outfit, even if some of their traits are questionable. Or is it as someone else touched on that the available talent pool for selly telly is so limited, channels have no option but to hire from it? If TJC had enough presenters on its books prior to Peter S etc becoming available, the fact they've been hired has to mean they're considered popular by viewers and as I say, good at shifting the tat?

 

[Hammy60]

When it comes to those presenters, surely the conclusion we have to reach is they shift product? Why else would they be hired. As we've touched on before, in the world of sales, if someone's shifting product they're a positive asset to the outfit, even if some of their traits are questionable. Or is it as someone else touched on that the available talent pool for selly telly is so limited, channels have no option but to hire from it? If TJC had enough presenters on its books prior to Peter S etc becoming available, the fact they've been hired has to mean they're considered popular by viewers and as I say, good at shifting the tat?

Although unfortunately we all know it happens, any retailor with a decent company ethos shouldn't be employing people (who are dealing directly with the public) with questionable traits, especially if they are using said traits to be good at shifting tat. To me that makes the company worse than the employee, money before morals.

 

[Hammy60]

What mattress did you get? Can I get a review if it's memory foam related, as thinking of trying one of those Emma/Tempur/Dormeo or hybrid type ones next.

The Tefal Ingenio set was nicely designed, but I thought the pricing of over £120+ or more was way over the top.

Hope you got a staff discount.

I've an Emma, although not the Original Foam type IW sold, I've the premium (mix of various foams & pockets springs), happy enough with quality etc, but it's firmer than I was expecting. Web site says it's 6.5 on a firmness scale of 1-10, i would say it's more like 8.

 

[Herring]

TJC HQ:

"Okay guys, it seems that naming our shows after wrestling terms isn't shifting stock any more. We need a new approach."

How about …a washed up former children's TV presenter shouting JUST BUY IT! KISS MY ANORAK! SHUT THE BACK DOOR!? while staring down the camera sticking his tongue out like a dying lizard?

"Excellent - that compliments our selection of fine jewellery perfectly."

And a wannabe social media influencer with a penchant for bragging about her expensive holidays and who was once a member of Bucks Fizz for two weeks during the 1990s?

"Perfect - her shrieking about our designer handbags will wake people up to our amazing deals"

And a walking grey grandfather clock whose skill set includes pointing thermometers at ceramic plates and sitting on Rattan awkwardly?

"C'mon, we're not desperate… We're TJC!"