Pearls - "Naturally Papaya" or Kate McCarthy "natural, organic"??

[AndyW]

Genuine Question: Kate McCarthy just offered for sale a pearl bracelet at £20 (First image attached). She explicitly repeated - and stressed - that they were "completely natural, organic". Second image is of a necklace on the auction page (one of those items that they leave up for a few hours, like TJC missed it) at £20. Erm, what are you actually buying?! It's an absolute nightmare finding any totally independent literature on pearls.

On the understanding that value is a totally subjective and, sometimes commercially controlled, concept and that pearls probably fall into the CBC category with diamonds (Controlled By Cartel), it seems as if a sort of rank for cultured pearls (forget La Pellegrina ) is:

1. South Sea (White & Gold)
2. Tahitian
3. Japanese Akoya
....
999. Chinese

What p*sses me off is that there's Charlie Barron cultured and then there's China where "natural" could mean sanded, bleached, dyed, heated and/or coated. None of these orchid colour pearls seem to come from anywhere except man-made lakes in China. And what the blazes are "naturally coloured" - is that like cornfed chicken?!

I love pearls and I have Charlie B South Sea & Japanese Akoya. I also have loose, undrilled ones from Gem Collector - you NEVER see "Kaori" loose pearls. I just can't buy these Chinese mass cultured things - produced by the tonne.

 

[user 17461]

If they're set into gold tone then they're probably crap with every treatment known to man performed on them. Especially if there's zero information for them available at any respected source.

 

[TheManWithNoName]

If they're set into gold tone then they're probably crap with every treatment known to man performed on them. Especially if there's zero information for them available at any respected source.

But Gemporia only put the finest heirloom pieces into Gold Tone.

You're not suggesting Gemporia tell lies are you?

 

[user 17461]

But Gemporia only put the finest heirloom pieces into Gold Tone.

You're not suggesting Gemporia tell lies are you?

I would love to know what the returns rate is on all these "legacy, heirloom pieces" in sumptuous gold tone Gemporia's been flogging over the last year plus.

I wouldn't dream of suggesting that Gemporia's totally trustworthy presenters and buyers would lie to the viewing public. I am pretty sure that they can fully explain all those minor, petty niggles we may have pointed out on this website.

In fact, I look forward to them doing so

 

[TheManWithNoName]

I would love to know what the returns rate is on all these "legacy, heirloom pieces" in sumptuous gold tone Gemporia's been flogging over the last year plus.

I wouldn't dream of suggesting that Gemporia's totally trustworthy presenters and buyers would lie to the viewing public. I am pretty sure that they can fully explain all those minor, petty niggles we may have pointed out on this website.

In fact, I look forward to them doing so

Quite high I would imagine. The Jadeite bangles with hinges seem to vanish for a while - and then they resurface again at a later date.

I suspect that they're getting a lot returned, and then they're putting them all in another showcase.

Those bangles have been on Gemporia, Lifestyle and even Jewellery Maker - but they STILL keep coming to air.

 

[Blossom]

Genuine Question: Kate McCarthy just offered for sale a pearl bracelet at £20 (First image attached). She explicitly repeated - and stressed - that they were "completely natural, organic". Second image is of a necklace on the auction page (one of those items that they leave up for a few hours, like TJC missed it) at £20. Erm, what are you actually buying?! It's an absolute nightmare finding any totally independent literature on pearls.

On the understanding that value is a totally subjective and, sometimes commercially controlled, concept and that pearls probably fall into the CBC category with diamonds (Controlled By Cartel), it seems as if a sort of rank for cultured pearls (forget La Pellegrina ) is:

1. South Sea (White & Gold)
2. Tahitian
3. Japanese Akoya
....
999. Chinese

What p*sses me off is that there's Charlie Barron cultured and then there's China where "natural" could mean sanded, bleached, dyed, heated and/or coated. None of these orchid colour pearls seem to come from anywhere except man-made lakes in China. And what the blazes are "naturally coloured" - is that like cornfed chicken?!

I love pearls and I have Charlie B South Sea & Japanese Akoya. I also have loose, undrilled ones from Gem Collector - you NEVER see "Kaori" loose pearls. I just can't buy these Chinese mass cultured things - produced by the tonne.

I have a pearl concern too.. I recently purchased the “cobalt grey” akoya pearl strand necklace thinking it was un-enhanced. The certificate of authenticity reports a ‘HD’ treatment ?? Heated- Dyed. Unfortunately i couldn’t find anything about this pearl treatment on the website.. Haven’t had time to email Gemporia yet. Anyone have any suggestions as to what the treatment maybe?
Many thanks in advance ..

 

[leslie61]

I have a pearl concern too.. I recently purchased the “cobalt grey” akoya pearl strand necklace thinking it was un-enhanced. The certificate of authenticity reports a ‘HD’ treatment ?? Heated- Dyed. Unfortunately i couldn’t find anything about this pearl treatment on the website.. Haven’t had time to email Gemporia yet. Anyone have any suggestions as to what the treatment maybe?
Many thanks in advance ..

It does state on the Gemporia website that HD is heated and dyed

HD = HEAT & DYE​

Enhancement by heat treatment and by the introduction of a colouring agent into a porous gemstone.

 

[user 17461]

It does state on the Gemporia website that HD is heated and dyed

HD = HEAT & DYE​

Enhancement by heat treatment and by the introduction of a colouring agent into a porous gemstone.

Gemporia presenters never, ever mention gems being dyed. Doesn't stop them raving about the colours as if they're totally natural, though.

And it doesn't stop Gemporia charging an arm and a leg for them: their ugly Lehrer Man in the Moon collection pieces always seem to be made using dyed stones. Tiny amounts of gold, dyed stones and someone else cutting them to Lehrer's design. Well worth paying £300 per item for

 

[Imogene9500]

Gemporia presenters never, ever mention gems being dyed. Doesn't stop them raving about the colours as if they're totally natural, though.

And it doesn't stop Gemporia charging an arm and a leg for them: their ugly Lehrer Man in the Moon collection pieces always seem to be made using dyed stones. Tiny amounts of gold, dyed stones and someone else cutting them to Lehrer's design. Well worth paying £300 per item for

Caveat emptor .. if stones are set in gold tone metal then cannot realistically be investment quality despite how they are presented. Look at the treatments too. If you like the price and item that's fine, but do not buy for 'investment', just if you will enjoy wearing. This is not Bonhams but not to say there are not nice reasonably priced items. Just need to be realistic about the value given what you are paying.

 

[user 17461]

Caveat emptor .. if stones are set in gold tone metal then cannot realistically be investment quality despite how they are presented. Look at the treatments too. If you like the price and item that's fine, but do not buy for 'investment', just if you will enjoy wearing. This is not Bonhams but not to say there are not nice reasonably priced items. Just need to be realistic about the value given what you are paying.

If you're used to questioning what you're being told, then you can see when something is far too good to be true, and make your decisions accordingly.

But when presenters routinely refuse to give viewers full information on the jewellery they're selling, either through obfuscation, omission or outright lying, and rave about coloured/dyed stones as if they're natural, and refuse to explain the difference between gold vermeil, Midas, gold tone and gold flash all while describing everything as "legacy" or "heirloom" worthy and giving stones like kyanite new names and overexcitedly describe them like they are Kashmir sapphires, then viewers don't have enough information to make a proper decision to buy AND are being very firmly guided to believe that they're getting something much better than they actually are.

Especially if viewers are new to the channel, or have zero real experience of gem buying. You're not going to question low prices if presenters are constantly screeching about the company's buying power, and how savings get passed on to customers. After all, presenters NEVER specifically state how much of a saving viewers are getting. It may seem obvious to long term viewers, or those who have bought real high end jewellery, that top-tier gems won't be coloured, dyed, filled and set into gold tone. And who take note of the treatment codes and look them up online.

But does every viewer have the sense to do that? Or even notice what's in the on-screen graphics besides basic gem info like their names and colours, and the final price? Would new viewers understand what this extra information means, and how to get explanations for it?

If Gemporia refuses to give viewers full details so they can make properly informed decisions, and relies instead on waffle and hyperbole, how is the viewer at fault?

 

[Imogene9500]

If you're used to questioning what you're being told, then you can see when something is far too good to be true, and make your decisions accordingly.

But when presenters routinely refuse to give viewers full information on the jewellery they're selling, either through obfuscation, omission or outright lying, and rave about coloured/dyed stones as if they're natural, and refuse to explain the difference between gold vermeil, Midas, gold tone and gold flash all while describing everything as "legacy" or "heirloom" worthy and giving stones like kyanite new names and overexcitedly describe them like they are Kashmir sapphires, then viewers don't have enough information to make a proper decision to buy AND are being very firmly guided to believe that they're getting something much better than they actually are.

Especially if viewers are new to the channel, or have zero real experience of gem buying. You're not going to question low prices if presenters are constantly screeching about the company's buying power, and how savings get passed on to customers. After all, presenters NEVER specifically state how much of a saving viewers are getting. It may seem obvious to long term viewers, or those who have bought real high end jewellery, that top-tier gems won't be coloured, dyed, filled and set into gold tone. And who take note of the treatment codes and look them up online.

But does every viewer have the sense to do that? Or even notice what's in the on-screen graphics besides basic gem info like their names and colours, and the final price? Would new viewers understand what this extra information means, and how to get explanations for it?

If Gemporia refuses to give viewers full details so they can make properly informed decisions, and relies instead on waffle and hyperbole, how is the viewer at fault?

I suppose we all have to take responsibility for whatever we decide to spend our money on but I completely agree so many Gemporia tactics are just plain wrong and may easily have the effect of misleading a lot of viewers especially newbies, but sadly the lawyers will keep Gemporia just on the side of what is legal

 

[AndyW]

I agree. It is very sad about the "heirloom"/"legacy" hard sell when it comes to the vulnerable but at least Tim Berners-Lee has enabled forums like this one. We gossip, snigger and sometimes bitch but also we give credit where it's due and share and own up to mistakes of our own making. The best we can hope is the people around those vulnerable people are more tech-savvy and circumspect

 

[TheManWithNoName]

After all, presenters NEVER specifically state how much of a saving viewers are getting.

These days, I doubt it's anything.

Do they even buy directly from mines these days? Their buying seems to revolve around trade events like Tucson, Hong Kong, etc.

If they're buying from traders, then they're no longer 'cutting out the middleman'.

I suspect that why we don't see guests any more such as Russell Twyford, Mark Saul, John Reed, The Aussie Opal guy, etc - even past regulars such as Yianni Melas, Glenn Lehrer and Charlie Barron seem to be on far less than they used to be.

 

[AndyW]

These days, I doubt it's anything.

Do they even buy directly from mines these days? Their buying seems to revolve around trade events like Tucson, Hong Kong, etc.

If they're buying from traders, then they're no longer 'cutting out the middleman'.

I suspect that why we don't see guests any more such as Russell Twyford, Mark Saul, John Reed, The Aussie Opal guy, etc - even past regulars such as Yianni Melas, Glenn Lehrer and Charlie Barron seem to be on far less than they used to be.

If you turned up at Charlie's Bond Street office and said "Show me your best Kaori pearls", you'd be out the door faster than a Midas ring loses its coating!

 

[SnowMoon]

These days, I doubt it's anything.

Do they even buy directly from mines these days? Their buying seems to revolve around trade events like Tucson, Hong Kong, etc.

If they're buying from traders, then they're no longer 'cutting out the middleman'.

I suspect that why we don't see guests any more such as Russell Twyford, Mark Saul, John Reed, The Aussie Opal guy, etc - even past regulars such as Yianni Melas, Glenn Lehrer and Charlie Barron seem to be on far less than they used to be.

Ooh, Russell Twyford... I rather liked him... Maybe they just don't want to pay plane fares and accommodation costs for these guests? Or, if they were on a percentage of sales for shows they appeared on, maybe Gems need to hang on to that at the moment to bail themselves out?

 

[TheManWithNoName]

Ooh, Russell Twyford... I rather liked him... Maybe they just don't want to pay plane fares and accommodation costs for these guests? Or, if they were on a percentage of sales for shows they appeared on, maybe Gems need to hang on to that at the moment to bail themselves out?

It doesn't make sense though when the Chinese are screaming out for Jadeite. If they're that desperate for cash, Dave could easily flog his Jade to the Chinese. After all, it can sell for up to £10,000 a carat.............. ;-)