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I cancelled my TSV on advanced orders; realistically I won't need anything for many months. I hope the brands can hang on to some degree of autonomy.
 
really bad news, as far as I am concerned
after some time of escalating drama
and what I thought looked to me like Brandon was having a meltdown/breakdown or manic episode
he has now gone into full self destruct mode and fired Co-CEO Nicola Kilner
and CFO also gone, two people who probably tried to talk some sense into him
and it looks like he is not going to stop until he has taken the whole shebang down with him
(EL has a small stake, decribed to me as in the 'low teens', what a ****** mess and blliddy shame)

Dr Esho said a couple of weeks ago that he did not seem like the man he knew in person,
and that something was wrong with him

p.s. Nicola has confirmed this news and said that she is too heartbroken to talk about it at this time
 
Akimbo said:
Feel sad for Nicola, what is he thinking?
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I am not a doctor but I think he is a having a kind of a breakdown,
a manic and self destructive episode,
and noone can stop him, as he is not listening to anyone,
and noone is above him, so noone can 'make him stop'
so he is probably not thinking, just acting out and lashing out
(he comes from a very sad background/childhood, so I can see how his mental health could be affected ...)

very sad for Nicola, and very unfair on her (and other staff most probably)
 
Gutted for Nicola, she's was always so enthusiastic and happy to be part of Deciem. I loved her presentations and she explained things really well. I've read so many things about Brandon recently, but this is the thing that has really shocked me. I hope it all doesn't go horribly wrong, I love my deciem.
 
I'll admit I didn't think I'd enjoy listening to Nicola but persevered because I was interested in the products and stopped just listening to her voice IYKWIM. I hope Brandon has someone close who he trusts to advise him to take a moment and stop the knee-jerk self-destruct reactions. Very worrying signs I'd agree.
 
lilith said:
I am not a doctor but I think he is a having a kind of a breakdown,
a manic and self destructive episode,
and noone can stop him, as he is not listening to anyone,
and noone is above him, so noone can 'make him stop'
so he is probably not thinking, just acting out and lashing out
(he comes from a very sad background/childhood, so I can see how his mental health could be affected ...)

very sad for Nicola, and very unfair on her (and other staff most probably)
Click to expand...

This is exactly what people were posting on Glassdoor that I posted some time earlier on one of the threads: favouritism in the head office, nepotism, sexism, verbal abuse, harassment, tantrums, gossiping about employees while leaving the office door open. People on the social media were saying that he was probably messed up and someone needs to convince him to see a specialist. Now see what’s happened! He must have come into a lot of money and feeling invincible, he is donating big sums left and right, to the elephants (50K?), to friends 500K and reducing the prices by 3%.

It has never sat well with me that he called his staff ‘monkeys’ on his website; and then there was a weird email where he explained the reason why, which didn’t make much sense. Also, recently, he demoted himself from CEO to ‘a worker.’

People on the social media started saying that he best leaves posting to deciem social team and rightly so, his posts say too much about his state. (In one of his posts he said he wasn't gay, for no apparent reason).

I hope he doesn’t sack the chemist Pruvdi!!!

This all looks like a car crash. I had great hopes that this brand was going to lead the way for other skincare brands.

Brandon is just a business entrepreneur, only in 2012 he had a graphic design company and now he is a skincare guru all over sudden. What he did, he invested his money in deciem and let the chemists to do their work. I'm sure he is going to apply himself elsewhere once deciem is in ruins.
 
lilith said:
really bad news, as far as I am concerned
after some time of escalating drama
and what I thought looked to me like Brandon was having a meltdown/breakdown or manic episode
he has now gone into full self destruct mode and fired Co-CEO Nicola Kilner
and CFO also gone, two people who probably tried to talk some sense into him
and it looks like he is not going to stop until he has taken the whole shebang down with him
(EL has a small stake, decribed to me as in the 'low teens', what a ****** mess and blliddy shame)

Dr Esho said a couple of weeks ago that he did not seem like the man he knew in person,
and that something was wrong with him

p.s. Nicola has confirmed this news and said that she is too heartbroken to talk about it at this time
Click to expand...

I suppose we can forget about the long awaited NIOD TSV for the foreseeable future.
 
Deary, deary me!!

I am not qualified in any way to speak of mental illness, so I won't speculate.

What a shame for the whole Deciem team. They must be frightened and demoralised by the dark turn the brand is taking.

EL are either going to look for an exit strategy or try a hostile takeover to protect their investment. Firing a CFO, unless there are strong grounds for doing so based on performance, will be ringing alarm bells with all the company's investors, not just EL.

Sometimes the entrepreneur who started the venture is not the one to keep it going. Instead of nurturing the company, he appears to have started a fire. He seems hell-bent on pouring gasoline on that fire.

What a crying shame. Exciting and abnormal is one thing but this is beyond that. Far, far, far beyond that.

It will be interesting to see what the social media beauty community reaction will be. Brandon was interviewed a month or so back by Nadine Baggott and had to keep interrupting him to stay on track. Caroline Hirons commented somewhat on her last empties video... I probably won't bother much with the US beauty bloggers as there's normally too much drama there already.


If nothing else I would send Brandon on a good holiday somewhere restful and without internet access for a week or so to process things and gain some perspective.
 
maymorganlondon said:
Deary, deary me!!

Caroline Hirons commented somewhat on her last empties video... I probably won't bother much with the US beauty bloggers as there's normally too much drama there already.
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She did and in response to that video he posted what she called a 'passive/aggressive' rant on her Instagram account. I can't find it now but he said he expected 'unconditional love', told her she could not give him advice as she had never built a beauty brand and accused her of discussing him and the Deciem brand to gain traffic to her Youtube video! She replied that she wasn't giving him advice, had raved about his product and didn't need his drama traffic :wonder:
 
Inside the Deciem Firings and Resignations
Founder Brandon Truaxe and the recently resigned CFO shed some light on what’s happening at the company.
By Cheryl Wischhover Feb 23, 2018, 2:22pm EST

https://www.racked.com/2018/2/23/17044982/deciem-firings-resignations-brandon-truaxe

After a few quiet weeks, beauty company Deciem finds itself back in the spotlight. Yesterday Racked broke the news that the company, which owns popular skincare brand The Ordinary, had lost co-CEO Nicola Kilner and CFO Stephen Kaplan. This came a few weeks after a period of intense scrutiny of founder Brandon Truaxe, whose increasingly erratic-appearing behavior on Instagram concerned fans of the brand. Stories from former employees then emerged, painting a picture of some chaos behind the scenes at the company as well.

Truaxe has since confirmed that Kilner was indeed fired and that CFO Stephen Kaplan, who had been with the company for less than a year, had resigned. Truaxe forwarded several internal Deciem emails to Racked, including information about the inner financial workings of the company and conversations with employees. In one email to Racked, he said the goal in sending these was “transparency,” and in another, he wrote: “There’s no trouble at Deciem. We are exploding, our customers love us and the drama media is creating will eventually die off and be discredited to your disadvantage.”


One shared email exchange was with Dr. Tijion Esho, the London-based cosmetic doctor who launched a lip-care line, called Esho, with Deciem. In a now-deleted Instagram post that arguably garnered Deciem and Truaxe the most online backlash during a week of heightened publicity, Truaxe ended his company’s relationship with Esho and said he was going to return the Esho brand’s trademarks. In an email, Truaxe told Esho he had to do it publicly, writing, “My partners would have never allowed me to freely give you this trademark after our investment to register it and develop the range.” In an exchange dated a few weeks later, Esho stated, “I think that I’m allowed to feel frustrated and upset,” and Truaxe responded, “You’re being very mean to me despite my explanation to you…”

In a statement provided to Racked by Esho’s representative, he said that he had been working with Kilner to recover his trademark and product formulations. Since her departure from the company two days ago, he notes a timeline is now “unconfirmed” and the fate of the line “undecided.” He hopes to still meet with Truaxe (who was in London this week, although Esho said that due to scheduling difficulties, a meeting was impossible) “to close this chapter.” He also wrote, in response to emails he received from Deciem employees, “I extended my gratitude and admiration for the individuals in the Deciem team. They showed me a lot of support and believed in me so I continue to be extremely grateful to that.”

The firing of co-CEO Nicola Kilner, which is likely to cause temporary confusion for the third parties she was responsible for working with, was a surprising development; she and Truaxe have always appeared to have a close bond. Kilner and Shamin Mohamed Jr., Deciem’s director of operations, had a now-disputed conversation about Truaxe’s mental health. When the CEO heard about it, it led to mistrust on his part. Truaxe eventually sided with Mohamed, a longtime friend whom he knew prior to starting Deciem, and questioned Kilner’s loyalty. When the blow-up occurred, Truaxe was visiting the brand’s Covent Garden store for a customer meet-and-greet and a visit from Estée Lauder, which has a minority stake in the brand.

Neha Gupta, Deciem’s human resources director, was there, and she described the scene on a call. “Brandon was crying on the floor. He was devastated,” she says. Gupta delivered the news to Kilner that she was being terminated after the decision was made.

Kilner offered only this statement: “I love Brandon and the team unconditionally and am too hurt to comment further.”

“I don’t want to let people go,” Truaxe says. “Hiring people is difficult. Firing them is very difficult, but when you have no choice, you have no choice. Ultimately, it doesn’t affect me. The only thing that matters is that the consumers are buying the product. But the drama is just hurting my team.”

Losing CFO Stephen Kaplan will also likely negatively affect the company, at least for a while. Kaplan, reached on a call while on vacation, confirmed he had resigned. Truaxe shared Kaplan’s official resignation email with Racked. It read, in part: “Taking into account everything that has been going on over the last few days, and especially after seeing your email regarding Nicola’s termination; I see no reason for my continued presence at Deciem.”


Truaxe says, “Stephen came to clean up our financials.” He then notes that perhaps it was a mistake to have given Kaplan “a little bit of power” in the company. “It is really destructive that Stephen could not just accept the fact that a 40-year-old is the CEO, and in his 60s he’s reporting to me.”

Kaplan declined to discuss the details, but says he came to his decision a few weeks ago, while also noting he really enjoyed his time at the company at first. “If anybody says anything, they’re terminated,” he says. “It’s not the way I want to live; it’s not the way you want to run a business. I think, unfortunately, in reality the two people who really tried to have Brandon’s back and the business’s back were Nicola and I. I am always going to voice my opinion; nothing’s going to hold me back. And Brandon didn’t like it.”

Truaxe also shared an email detailing a laundry list of financial projects that Kaplan had been working on with his team. One involves an audit in which there was an accounts receivable issue that could potentially result in an income reduction for the company of 3.2 million Canadian dollars (about $2.5 million). Of this, Truaxe says, “He screwed up the audit.” However, industry sources note that an adjustment like this can be normal for a growing company. Without more information and context, it’s impossible to analyze the meaning of this information.

“There were a lot of numbers that we had to just work out,” Kaplan says. “Deciem didn’t have books that were done that were easy to work on, so in this last week or so I worked out that it was an issue we better resolve when I got back.” (He had planned a vacation prior to resigning.)


Estée Lauder remains a minority investor with the company. Truaxe told Women’s Wear Daily that its investment was 28 percent and his was 72 percent. When asked by Racked about keeping the business on track after these new developments, he says, “We’re on track. Nothing has changed. Our business has exploded. We’ve gone from $45 million to $260 million this year. Why is nobody saying, ‘What an amazing story!’?”

After Kilner was fired, Truaxe sent an email (shared with Racked) to Leonard Lauder, patriarch of the Lauder family and chairman emeritus of the Estée Lauder Companies. It read, in part:

I’m out of breath and have left our store. I’ll terminate Nicola with generosity and gentleness tonight. If your team starts to worry, please let them know that I am calm and am not making any irrational decisions. I’m worried about your team’s view of me more than anything... I’m so sorry, Leonard. I know you did not invest in me to live a painful drama. I’ll work hard to make it up to you and your team.

It’s unclear if Lauder responded. An Estée Lauder representative sent the following statement: “The Estée Lauder Companies is a minority investor in Deciem, and, as such, we do not have the power to control the company’s operations, social media or personnel decisions. We believe in Deciem’s incredible creativity, innovation and product offerings.”

Besides expressing some concerns about raising more working capital, Truaxe is confident about Deciem’s future. He anticipates that two new manufacturing facilities will open in April. He claims Deciem has six new manufacturing partners and that the company has been producing “millions of units more” per month. Many of The Ordinary’s products are currently sold out at Sephora.

When asked if he had spoken to Sephora representatives about the recent company shake-ups, Truaxe said he hadn’t. “I love them. But if they don’t want to be my partner, that’s okay, because we are the ones driving the sales, not them. It’s consumer demand,” he says. “If Sephora wants to kick us out because Nicola has left, that’s okay. The customer will come to us directly... I’m happy with [our] store growth.” Truaxe also mentioned that products would be entering Ulta, though that partnership had been delayed “over a year” because of stock issues. Ulta did not respond to a request for comment as of publication time.

Finally, what does Truaxe make of the backlash from fans for his sometimes unconventional social media posts and those who perceived he had insulted them on Instagram? “They insulted me,” he says, voice rising. “It’s my brand. People who have never had a job in their life successfully are not going to tell me what I should and shouldn’t do. If they don’t like it, Instagram allows you to block me, it allows you not to follow me, but you cannot stand there and say what I can or cannot do. There was only one day I got emotional.”

Truaxe started this whole conversation by discussing his former employees, saying, “I don’t want to hurt them. I just want them to stop hurting me.” He ended the conversation on the same theme.

“When employees leave, they leave with a grudge, they leave with anger, which is on both sides. But if you fuel that, anger is the most powerful emotion, but it lasts only a second,” Truaxe says. “Love takes longer, but it continues. I love our team. We’re happy. Why would I destroy the most beautiful thing I’ve built? It doesn’t make emotional sense, it doesn’t make financial sense... The proof is always in what the consumer thinks. Go and read our reviews. Go read the people who met me at the Covent Garden store, go on our Instagram and see what they’re saying about me. The truth is very obvious.”
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In a nutshell

https://www.racked.com/2018/2/22/17039766/deciem-co-ceo-fired

Co-CEO Out at Deciem, Troubled Parent Company of Skincare Brand The Ordinary
By Cheryl Wischhover Feb 22, 2018, 9:13am EST


Deciem, the parent company of mega-popular, inexpensive skincare line The Ordinary, has been experiencing drama behind the scenes. It started with weeks of speculation about founder Brandon Truaxe’s erratic behavior on the brand’s Instagram page and the discovery of some damning Glassdoor reviews about the company’s work environment. As reported by Racked a few weeks ago, former employees described a chaotic workplace and bullying management. Truaxe continued to post, spending a day insulting commenters, and even writing that he would give raises to the two managers accused of bullying behavior. (This comment has since been deleted.) Things then quieted down, with posts about new product launches and a message from Truaxe about an appearance at the brand’s Covent Garden store in London.

Now Racked has learned that co-CEO Nicola Kilner, who was with the company since almost its inception, is no longer with the company. When asked for confirmation, Kilner said via text message, “Sadly yes. I’m too heartbroken to talk about it at the moment.” (Racked had been tipped that she was let go, but a public relations representative has said this is unconfirmed.)

Racked also received a tip that CFO Stephen Kaplan had resigned. The company would not confirm nor deny this, and had no official statement. An email to Kaplan bounced back with an out-of-office message. He had previously told Racked, “We definitely have grown too quickly, there’s no question, and that’s part of why I was brought on.”

We will update this story as it develops.

Update: February 22nd, 2018, 9:55 a.m.

Founder Brandon Truaxe emailed the following message to Racked:

“I have terminated employment of several people at DECIEM who do not subscribe to my peaceful values. I have also cc’d Estée Lauder’s management on here. I hope you’re well and smiling.”
Click to expand...
 
Marina said:
This is exactly what people were posting on Glassdoor that I posted some time earlier on one of the threads: favouritism in the head office, nepotism, sexism, verbal abuse, harassment, tantrums, gossiping about employees while leaving the office door open. People on the social media were saying that he was probably messed up and someone needs to convince him to see a specialist. Now see what’s happened! He must have come into a lot of money and feeling invincible, he is donating big sums left and right, to the elephants (50K?), to friends 500K and reducing the prices by 3%.

It has never sat well with me that he called his staff ‘monkeys’ on his website; and then there was a weird email where he explained the reason why, which didn’t make much sense. Also, recently, he demoted himself from CEO to ‘a worker.’

People on the social media started saying that he best leaves posting to deciem social team and rightly so, his posts say too much about his state. (In one of his posts he said he wasn't gay, for no apparent reason).

I hope he doesn’t sack the chemist Pruvdi!!!

This all looks like a car crash. I had great hopes that this brand was going to lead the way for other skincare brands.

Brandon is just a business entrepreneur, only in 2012 he had a graphic design company and now he is a skincare guru all over sudden. What he did, he invested his money in deciem and let the chemists to do their work. I'm sure he is going to apply himself elsewhere once deciem is in ruins.
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where did you see that Marina?
he left Indeed Labs in 2012, which he founded, the makers of Hydraluron (a beautry company)
and then he had also founded EUOKO (sp?) another beauty company
this info is widely quoted, so where did you get your info from?
 
lilith said:
where did you see that Marina?
he left Indeed Labs in 2012, which he founded, the makers of Hydraluron (a beautry company)
and then he had also founded EUOKO (sp?) another beauty company
this info is widely quoted, so where did you get your info from?
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Yes, I saw it, and it was in one of the links I posted earlier in one of the deciem/niod threads, I now cant't remember which one.
I'll see if I can find it. It was on racket I think.
 
Here it is lilith, it was on reddit. I’ve highlighted it below.


Marina said:
There's some interesting reading on Glassdoor - deciem profile, that I've come across through a post on the web.

https://www.glassdoor.co.uk/Reviews/DECIEM-Reviews-E1054878.htm?countryRedirect=true

This was the original post

https://www.reddit.com/r/muacjdiscu...oing_on_with_deciem_social_media[/COLOR][/B]/
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WillGrahamsLiver 88 points 18 days ago
I’m a graphic designer. Back in 2012 I lost my job and went with an agency to try to find work. The only position that agency pulled up for me was for a start-up called Deciem. The only info he gave me was that it was a very small team and the CEO Brandon was very passionate, quirky but at the same time spontaneous, all over the place and unpredictable. At the time I noticed that Deciem was the parent brand for all these other brands, which at the time had NOTHING to do with beauty. It was more for clothing, accessories some photography services etc. The selection seemed random.

After the agency interview, I found the Glassdoor reviews and decided to opt out of the real interview with Brandon and his team because I wasn’t looking for graphic design slave labour.

It surprised me very much when Deciem turned up in the beauty world and I avoided the products thinking, how good could they actually be? Back in 2012 there was no indication that Brandon was into all the science-y stuff that The Ordinary and NIOD spouts, let alone beauty in general.

That being said, I do like products from The Ordinary and NIOD but I might have to unfollow if their Insta is going to turn into the altar of Brandon.

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[–]calicovirus 37 points 18 days ago*
Interesting you say 2012. I was working not too far away from their Richmond St HQ in 2011 and I remember seeing their HQ, because I drove past it every morning for a couple of months and it was so ~mysterious, with that clock sign and everything. I had it marked off in my brain as a photography/design place. And yet their own website says they were founded in 2013. So strange...

edit: So I was still curious about this and I went to check on LinkedIn. Brandon Truaxe's profile says that Deciem was founded in March 2012 on there. It seems though that he discounts whatever they were doing in 2012 in more official versions of the history. Bizarre.
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You may or may have not noticed over the past week or so, Deciem social media has totally overhauled and gone in a direction I've never really seen from any brand before. All posts are done by founder Brandon, and they're strangely personal and genuine and open, to a level that's either refreshing or uncomfortable, I'm not sure. Looking at it completely at face value it should be nothing out of the ordinary (..lol); it's just a guy who's passionate about his company, and his customers, and knows that being in power, he can make a difference in both. Maybe it's because we're all used to being held at arms length by brands, but it's really weird to read and watch his videos, to see him call out his packaging people in the comments, or instruct his team on stocking and pricing products for all of us to see. Part of me thinks (and hopes) it's actually all genuine and I'm simply not used to it, part of me thinks it's a totally calculated move on the company's side, and a small part of me hopes the guy's okay and not having some sort of breakdown, as I've seen other people concern over.

Anyway, just some really strange moves all around. What are your thoughts on Deciem's recent change in the way they're handling social media?

EDIT: Just got linked to their Glassdoor and.... what the **** is going on at this company.

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[–]ttandrew 310 points 18 days ago
Having the founder run a brand’s social media is... questionable to say the least especially with what that can entail. Let’s not forget hotplategate

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[–]UhmmmNope 49 points 18 days ago
Exactly what I was thinking! Didn’t this happen with several other indie brands that resulted in a hot mess?

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[–]opalescentessence 25 points 18 days ago
Cozzette if I remember correctly did this too

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[–]fckingmiracles 35 points 17 days ago
Deer Doe/Lime Crime, Cozzette recently, Z palette, Too Faced/Jerrod Blandino, Carol/Laroc here on reddit. It's always fishy, embarrassing and off-turning to me and makes me not buy these brands anymore. Just staaahp, people.

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[–]Aleena_Perez 24 points 17 days ago
While you do have a lot of good examples, I can think of just as many indies whos founders have been hands on that aren't problematic. the problem isn't the transparency of a brand it's that the owners are just horrible people and it's probably a good thing we get to see that so we know what we are and aren't supporting.

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[–]opalescentessence 3 points 17 days ago
I didn't see anything about Lorac but that's unfortunate

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[–]fckingmiracles 24 points 17 days ago
Carol did an AMA some years back and it was ~awkward~ for everyone involved.

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[–]coolintello 3 points 17 days ago
Do you have a link maybe?

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[–]chocolatechoux 9 points 17 days ago
np.reddit.com/r/MakeupAddiction/comments/3bnrbh/i_am_carol_shaw_founder_of_lorac_cosmetics_ama/

It's been deleted, but you can still find her comments at /u/Glamodo

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[–]coolintello 1 point 17 days ago
thanks

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[–][deleted] 17 days ago
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[–]Avbfacechats 2 points 17 days ago
I keep thinking about LC a few years ago

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[–]anniecakes 19 points 17 days ago
hotplategate

Help, I'm out of the loop :(

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[–]****fartz 40 points 17 days ago
I hope someone adds more to this because I don't really remember more than z palette made like an $80 hotplate to de pot makeup with and then the owner or whatever I guess went off on people in the comments who either said it was too much or a dumb idea or whatever and lot of people swore they'd never buy a z palette again after that

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[–]irissteensma 56 points 17 days ago
Some of the comments were along the lines of (paraphrasing) "Too bad you're too poor to buy this, broke college student. Have fun destroying your makeup."

It was ridiculous.

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[–]blackcats666 16 points 17 days ago
I think you've basically summed it all up perfectly there tbh

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[–]hipoopi 2 points 11 days ago
they could answer that by "hey, we know you're a college student, here's a 20% coupon for you to get started" that would bring in some loyal customers.

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[–]colletteardith 1 point 11 days ago
Yeah it's kind of obnoxious. He's been now blocking people who give any sort of criticism (even if it's nicely put). I, too, got blocked. -_-

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[–]Nephthys88 106 points 18 days ago
I found it a bit strange cos it sounded like he was semi-ranting, especially the post on eliminating plastic packaging. I definitely would not like to be peter of Mong packaging for sure...

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[–]MxUnicorn 128 points 18 days ago
Yeah, why is he getting so specific with suppliers he works with on social media? Who TF announces "sorry we're leaving you for this company but will totally sponsor your immigration" anyways??

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[–]Nephthys88 55 points 18 days ago
I know right? That seemed really unnecessary. To me when I read in between the lines, he’s like saying your company is **** and I feel sorry for you so I’ll be the nice guy here and offer you a position in deceim which is a way better company.

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[–]blackcats666 384 points 18 days ago
Ok here’s my conspiracy theory:

Deciem is letting Brandon loose so the executive board can fire him for being messy and open themselves up to fully sell their souls to Estée Lauder.

Deciem can then blame Brandon. “Oh we had no choice to sell because Brandon went crazy and alienated our suppliers and customer base. Then he donated all our money. Our hands were tied it was this or going bust”

Brandon can then go off and freely post his weird **** and still be the cruelty free earth goddess cult leader he is under his own name

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[–]OldMollyOxford 89 points 18 days ago
Tbh this strikes me as a very likely scenario. EL forced Bobbi Brown out of her own brand when they bought it, and it seems pretty standard MO for them with the brands they buy out...

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[–]mackinnon_13 63 points 17 days ago
Bobbi Brown the brand has been part of the EL group since 1995. Bobbi Brown the person left the brand in late 2016.

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[–]ASK_ME_IF_IM_YEEZUS 17 points 18 days ago
Seems like the opposite happened with Too Faced though, right?

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[–]OldMollyOxford 18 points 18 days ago
Possibly? But I kind of wonder if they're playing a similar game with Jerrod, too, in the long term...

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[–]commelejardin 57 points 18 days ago
I get the feeling Jerrod is on-board with EL leadership. Most of the founders who leave do so because of a loss of creative control, real or perceived; I think Jerrod is honestly on-board with the EL business model of constant new releases of questionable quality, ha.

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[–]OldMollyOxford 11 points 18 days ago
ha, also very plausible!

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[–]Sage_of_Winds 191 points 18 days ago
At least Deceim will actually have **** in stock if they get bought by Estee Lauder.

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[–]Mrs_Moo 32 points 17 days ago
But the price will go up one million percent ��

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[–]CS3883 14 points 17 days ago
This is exactly what keeps me from buying from them. Sure I can sign up for the email alerts and just keep checking nonstop but i rarely check my email in the first place so I still would never know when they go in stock. And seeing comments on SCA about how they have had product in their cart for it to sell out while they are checking out and the lose it. Wtf? So now I have to worry about getting an email alert and still hoping I can finish my checkout before it gets snagged. i really want to try their products but cant tell if all the hype is worth it..think for now Im just going to stick to other products and see how those work

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[–]badgerm 4 points 14 days ago
I totally agree. Spending money shouldn’t be so hard.

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[–]CS3883 2 points 14 days ago
Exactly! I mean do they not want peoples money? lol Im not sure why they are so hard to keep in stock, idk if its a legit reason out of their control or not. But its really annoying. I want to give them my money! But Im not going to bother if I have to go through so much hassle and wait.

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[–]miriena 2 points 13 days ago
Imo if it's a matter of sourcing ingredients on the cheap to keep prices low, then I guess stock issues make sense (suppliers might not have said cheap ingredients available as often as we'd all like). But who knows what the issue actually is, of course...

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[–]CS3883 1 point 13 days ago
Ah ok well that does make sense then. i think I saw someone mention that on SCA but I havent seen it mentioned anywhere else so wasnt sure

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[–]lesmisfan12 27 points 18 days ago
r/muaconspiracy except I am totally on board with this theory lol

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[–]cleeh90 92 points 18 days ago*
cruelty free earth goddess cult leader

I approve this message specifically because this is the new identity he's showing in his latest posts. It is ... interesting to say the least.

Edit: words, I admit when I spout nonsense (unlike him)

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[–]testaholic 36 points 18 days ago
cruelty free earth goddess cult leader

I laughed way too hard at this

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[–]MxUnicorn 27 points 18 days ago
At this point I wouldn't even be mad if they sold out to EL.

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[–]WillGrahamsLiver 88 points 18 days ago
I’m a graphic designer. Back in 2012 I lost my job and went with an agency to try to find work. The only position that agency pulled up for me was for a start-up called Deciem. The only info he gave me was that it was a very small team and the CEO Brandon was very passionate, quirky but at the same time spontaneous, all over the place and unpredictable. At the time I noticed that Deciem was the parent brand for all these other brands, which at the time had NOTHING to do with beauty. It was more for clothing, accessories some photography services etc. The selection seemed random.

After the agency interview, I found the Glassdoor reviews and decided to opt out of the real interview with Brandon and his team because I wasn’t looking for graphic design slave labour.

It surprised me very much when Deciem turned up in the beauty world and I avoided the products thinking, how good could they actually be? Back in 2012 there was no indication that Brandon was into all the science-y stuff that The Ordinary and NIOD spouts, let alone beauty in general.

That being said, I do like products from The Ordinary and NIOD but I might have to unfollow if their Insta is going to turn into the altar of Brandon.

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[–]calicovirus 37 points 18 days ago*
Interesting you say 2012. I was working not too far away from their Richmond St HQ in 2011 and I remember seeing their HQ, because I drove past it every morning for a couple of months and it was so ~mysterious, with that clock sign and everything. I had it marked off in my brain as a photography/design place. And yet their own website says they were founded in 2013. So strange...

edit: So I was still curious about this and I went to check on LinkedIn. Brandon Truaxe's profile says that Deciem was founded in March 2012 on there. It seems though that he discounts whatever they were doing in 2012 in more official versions of the history. Bizarre.

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[–]swimmingmonkey 76 points 18 days ago
Deciem’s social media has always been grating (their marketing copy takes pretentious to a whole new level) but lately it’s jumped off the deep end. The last newsletter they sent (because somehow I subscribed to that) was bizarre. I don’t follow Deciem on social media because it’s so obnoxious, but I did take a quick look and I feel like something is going on in the background there.

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[–]anysize 17 points 18 days ago
What did the newsletter say?

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[–]steenface 95 points 18 days ago
Copied from the newsletter sent about a week ago:

Hi :) You have often asked us why we refer to our team as monkeys. Our lovey @nicolalkilner used to be a buyer at @bootsuk. She once told me that a major beauty brand always hired sales representatives who looked like models because their presence in meetings was impactful. I can't think of anything dumber than choosing people who are to represent your values based largely on their appearance. So I decided that we are going to very specifically not care about our team looking like models (if some of us do, then we are doubly lucky), and instead be so humble to say we are symbolically monkeys, because monkeys are the origin of all of us, whether or not we are models. But I also don't think monkeys are better than any other animal. Animals and us are all together working on this beautiful small planet we call Earth. I fell in love with all animals during my fortunate visits to Africa and South East Asia. I particularly love elephants because my very good friend Gill Sinclair of our caring and patient retailer, @victoriahealth, loves them and because an elephant once let me ride his loving back in Java, Indonesia, near the Borobudur Temple. Lastly, speaking of elephants, I once wrote that one would have to be drunk to overpay for Marula oil which was a distasteful joke that arose from my familiarity with the beautiful brand, @drunkelephantskincare. @tiffanymasterson: I'm sorry. When I met you at the WWD breakfast, I saw a beautiful soul. And you have worked hard to build a beautiful brand. Please forgive me. I have now adjusted that distasteful post and we will donate $25,000 to the peaceful elephant charity that your brand supports: @savetheelephants. Our super-fast and loving @smjr2000 will arrange for this donation to be made this week. Hug, Brandon

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[–]poptartly 129 points 18 days ago
Wtf did I just read

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[–]Avbfacechats 33 points 17 days ago
This was the Instagram post that got me in the rabbit hole I'm now in learning everything unsavory about this dude

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[–]casillalater 6 points 16 days ago
+1 I'm trying to restart my brain now

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[–]eucalyptusqueen 67 points 18 days ago*
I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought that this was incredibly bizarre. I read this like three times and every time it got a little bit weirder. I need to unsubscribe from their newsletter asap

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[–]PhantaVal 55 points 18 days ago
Woooww, that is so inspiring! Your kindness and generosity shines through in every post!!

-- almost every follower on their Instagram

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[–]Daheep 70 points 18 days ago
I remember that one. I also remember thinking, "If you got time to write this 'masterpiece', you got time to get my 100ml moisturizer back in stock, son."

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[–]blackcats666 32 points 18 days ago
Seeing this posted word for word on sca circlejerk made me feel warm and fuzzy inside

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[–]nopantsjimmy 27 points 17 days ago
I'm weirded out by the needed to mention the person who'd arrange the donation. That's just oddly unprofessional of him. Also, this is nitpicking and it's been along time since I've taken an anthropology class but humans descend from apes and not monkeys right?

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[–]craycrayeyelinerblush iz luv, blush is #lyfe 18 points 17 days ago
Humans are apes, and we share a common ancestor with monkeys.

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[–]nopantsjimmy 7 points 17 days ago
I'm aware of the first part but I feel like it'd be more logical to use an ape as their mascot then. But that's neither here or there

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[–]bambkac0 11 points 17 days ago
Naming the employee and calling them out as "super-fast" reads to me like shade or passive-aggressively ordering them to get on it. How many times has my boss copied me on an email including a line "My assistant will do that immediately."
But this is a newsletter to the world...

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[–]changement 24 points 18 days ago
I feel like I'm on drugs now.

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[–]sarriathmg 9 points 17 days ago
I also got that email a week ago, thought it looks like stuff I wrote for school when I was 12...when I used to start with a point then go nowhere and everywhere from there.

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[–]sarriathmg 3 points 17 days ago
I also got that email a week ago, thought it looks like stuff I wrote for school when I was 12...when I used to start with a point then go nowhere and everywhere from there.

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[–]nopantsjimmy 100 points 18 days ago
Honestly it just sounds like he's having a mental breakdown/existential crisis.

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[–]Snwussy 25 points 18 days ago
The first thing I thought of reading about all this stuff this morning was Lucian Piane's (producer on a couple of RuPaul's albums and usually helped with Drag Race's music-oriented challenges) breakdown a few months ago... although perhaps to a much lesser extent. If Brandon is having mental health problems I hope he gets the help he needs.

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[–]stoaway76 155 points 18 days ago*
People started posting on Glassdoor about their bad experiences working there and it seems that he is the one of the reasons they are giving the company a bad rating. Also kindofstephen posted a second hand account of how a man, probably Brandon, is treating one of the employees to instagram stories.

My guess is Brandon is trying to make himself more personable. He wants costumers to see him as a nice, passionate person and not as an abusive ******* tyrant boss.

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[–]Anonymous73648839 149 points 18 days ago*
I managed to read the first page of Glassdoor reviews. Then I headed over to see the IG stories of /u/kindofstephen and wow wow wow. Stephen has highlighted many reviews particularly exposing how the CEO is abusive, sexist, racist to his employees and others, hires immigrants at minimum wage, fires people according to his liking, etc.

Honestly? I believe these claims, especially the racist part, based on one experience I’ve personally had. Once upon a time I felt uneasy about one of Brandon’s “personal letter” which included a sentence that said they will never sell to China, which “plagues” the beauty industry. So I went on their social media and told them this sounds racially insensitive if not charged, and that it could potentially resonate with some people who are already prejudiced against anything to do with China. I advised them to show this to their Chinese employees to see if it makes all of them feel comfortable. The results was the social media handler claiming that I have holes in my brain, and that I was a hopeless nationalist from China who’s brainwashed and overly sensitive, and that they were not gonna reply to me because I accused their CEO Brandon of being a bootlicker to racists, then they blocked me. I’ve said it then and i’m saying it now: this cult that they’ve created surrounding their CEO is terrifying. I didn’t even care for what their CEO’s name was, I initially went into the discussion because i thought they made an honest mistake, and i wanted to give them a friendly reminder to be more sensitive. But whoever was handling their social media at the time was making it insanely personal, as if I was attacking their god.

Yet, my thoughts have changed a bit since this incident: now I regret resenting the social media workers and all Deciem employees, because for all we know, it could be Brandon just popping on social media to reply me that day, or it could be that the employees who don’t kiss his ass and worship him simply don’t have a chance of surviving in that company.

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[–]TraummichLight Yagami is my dream man 52 points 18 days ago
That is beyond what anyone should think, let alone say.... why couldnt he just nicely say "oh we wanna be cruetly free, nothing against China or Chinese people" (in a professional way) instead of accusing you? You were helping them!

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[–]Anonymous73648839 33 points 18 days ago*
Yes, they didn’t have to agree with my thoughts over their choice of words in that letter (and that’s why i wanted them to ask other Chinese people to see if it was potentially alienating customers like myself, for their company’s sake). I knew several other Chinese people who questioned the same issue got shut down pretty quickly as well.

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[–]scumteam14 107 points 18 days ago*
they will never sell to China, which “plagues” the beauty industry.

And yet, they have white primer that has

"frosted white" particles are unlike any white pigment resulting in a very natural looking white skin appearance deemed impossible before

and that

Offers protection against the effects of pollution on the skin common in larger Eastern cities where a desire for whiter-looking skin is strong.

Reduces visible tones of yellow to make the skin appear naturally radiant, even and healthy-looking

They feel comfortable publicly marketing this weird ****. This is their product description. No wonder this bleeds out into their social media, cuz it's ingrained in their damn products.

I'm glad you sent them feedback, and I'm sorry that they responded that way. I had been considering at one point sending them some feedback on their WhiteRx line, which gets...weirdly worded, but now I'm glad I didn't. It clearly would not have gone over well.

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[–]tokillamockingjay 33 points 17 days ago
The WhiteRx products weird me out so much. They used to have this before/after photo and the "after" photo, using all the whitening products, looked waaay worse than the model's natural skintone from the "before" photo. And the before/after photo was of an East Asian model so, yknow, racist undertones abound there.

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[–]nillbog 1 point 11 days ago
I live in Japan, in "East Asia" half the products here are for whitening. Thats what the market wants as it's a sign of beauty. It sounds like you have a bigger problem with Asians who want whitened skin.

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[–]tokillamockingjay 5 points 11 days ago
What? I think you're misunderstanding me here... Deciem is a North America based, Canadian-owned company. For them to make and market whitening products, using an Asian woman in their pictures to show that the "after" result of using said products is the more "desireable" whiter skin, is evident of the presence of white-centric beauty standards. I'm not saying what you're accusing me of, and I'm confused where you are getting that from.

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[–]nillbog 0 points 4 days ago
I don't think you fully understand the culture of whitening products to Asians. Are you saying its racist to use an Asian model or that they simply created a whitening product? Neither is racist. Look at K-beauty's boom in America. Having a Whitening product could have boosted Deciem's overseas sales. They are certainly not just a company that sells to Canada and North America. "White-centric" skincare isn't common in America. Pale people are called ghosts and Tan skin is definitely associated with being sexier. Either way pale skin was valued historically because it showed you didn't go outside and work. Which meant you were rich. And here in Japan we definitely still live in a culture where people like to appear rich. It think globally most people do. Bottom line they used an Asian model because they are the primary demographic for whitening products.

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[–]Anonymous73648839 44 points 18 days ago
Wow I’ve never read these before, it’s... really weird, especially that “reducing visible tones of yellow”.

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[–]Nessyliz 17 points 17 days ago
Wtf, that's just straight up racist!!

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[–]pissliquors 17 points 17 days ago
Reading stuff like this makes me so angry that I finally ordered something from them last week. I've never paid attention to their social media and I'm appalled at all the things coming out. I would have never tried anything if I knew ****ery like this was going on.

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[–]millennialpinkfarts 32 points 18 days ago
The attitude is so disgusting. Sorry you had to experience that.

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[–]ASK_ME_IF_IM_YEEZUS 27 points 18 days ago
Ya know.. I was kind of on the fence about TO products anyway, I think imma just pass on them now.

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[–]Whisk3yTang0F0xtr0t 19 points 18 days ago
What the ****, I'm so sorry you had that shitty encounter with what possibly could've been Brandon.

If his idea of getting things done is either brute force deride employees wannabe-"Steve Jobs"-style and go full control-freak-autocrat, I can now see the mentality about how they handled their inability to fulfill orders on time and bad customer service.

I never though I'd ever say this, but I hope Estee Lauder has a big enough stake in Deciem for their board to oust Brandon and replace him with someone both more competent and less abusive.

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[–]blackcats666 62 points 18 days ago
Adding to his gross anti Chinese sentiment is his weird post to his packaging manufacturer.

Telling him (via IG no less) that he’s no longer going to use him but it’s ok because Brandon will sponsor him to immigrate to superior Canada from inferior China which he will obviously want to leave now he is missing out on the superior deciem dollars. No other possible reason he might want to stay right? He’s so lucky for gracious Brandon saving him from his fate

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[–]casillalater 4 points 16 days ago
I know that this is serious but I'm awkwardly laughing because it's so crazy that someone would even do this let alone the CEO. wtf

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[–]nonny102928 10 points 17 days ago
According to glassdoor reviews employee’s are treated very poorly by the “ceo”. Unfortunate that he denies all the claims people have been saying about him on glassdoor and manipulating people’s thoughts by painting this innocent and perfect image on social media. There are various claims about his character, morale, judgement and even relationship. And he uses his power on social media to deny all of the claims.

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[–]xXMistressEveXx 16 points 18 days ago
Maybe he's referring to China's regulation laws? "DECIEM and The Ordinary do not test on animals and do not ask others to do so. For this reason, none of our brands or products are sold in mainland China since such sales require animal testing for registration purposes." From the FAQ section of The Ordinary's website.

But the employee's cult mindset is pretty disturbing. That doesn't seem healthy at all.

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[–]Anonymous73648839 51 points 18 days ago*
I agree, i knew he was referring to the animal testing regulations which we all can agree is totally unnecessary, and i respect them to not want to sell in mainland China because of their cruelty-free stance, which i acknowledged in my communications to them; but I personally had “beef” with their vocabulary “plague” because of my personal experiences with racist people associating China & its people as backwards, uncivilized, barbaric and even “dirty”. I thought their letter could’ve been phrased in a different way.

Ninja edited some words because I pressed send too fast :)

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[–]colletteardith 2 points 11 days ago
I got blocked today on their instagram, and so did a ton of other people too, supposedly. I wasn't even being mean!

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[–]mayfleur5 44 points 18 days ago
I started getting emails about monkeys or gorillas or something a couple of weeks ago and I immediately unsubscribed.

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[–]cerwytha 79 points 18 days ago
It's really unprofessional imo, it's the kind of thing that's always a step away from a media disaster. Maybe they can pull it off and make it work, but it makes me feel less inclined to give them my money in the future.

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[–]AngelachasedIG: @einepriseglitzer 22 points 18 days ago
yep me, too. Sharing a video once a while about the working process/manufacturing/lab is ok in my eyes but this is just completely unprofessional. I don't really feel like supporting them in the future, especially with all the awful work experiences.

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[–]testaholic 105 points 18 days ago
Whether he is having a manic episode or he just really feels strongly that "one man show" and "personality cult" is the right way for Deciem to go right now, the bottom line is that some die hard fans (me included) are not happy about this. If you check the account on SocialBlade you can see that it's the first time since launching that he account is losing a lot of followers. And when I tried to voice my concerns in comments of his latest post his reply was that I should just follow on Facebook instead. Also a lot of his followers accused me of not being open minded, preferring robots over human interaction, lacking ethics and generally not being a worthy fan. So it got a little bit too cult-ish for my taste...I just Unfollowed and that's that. I will still buy the products though, because Deciem to me is not just Brandon and his desperate need for attention. For now at least.

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[–]katerunka 21 points 18 days ago
Apparently even deciem thinks that Brandon is screwed up!

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[–]PinkFurLookinLikeCam 14 points 18 days ago
Yeah I jumped ship soon as I realized there weren’t going to be anymore skincare related release info; I’ll just lurk r/Skincareaddiction for that info

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[–]shogomomo 3 points 15 days ago
I saw your comment, and thought that reply was a really weird way to handle it!

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[–]anysize 107 points 18 days ago
I’m so glad that his egomaniacal tirade is blowing up in his face. Personal accounts of his abusive management style have floated in the Toronto beauty world for years. When I heard his interview on the Breaking Beauty podcast I wanted to barf - on the surface he seems friendly, principled, badass. Yet knowing his reputation for belittling and screaming at his staff, there were so many red flags.

I work in social media and my jaw dropped watching his video about their Instagram “attempting to be hacked.” This literally means that they received an email saying, “Forgot your password?” That he published a video declaring he’s barred his social team from doing their jobs while accusing competitors and past staff of “hacking” is unconscionable.

This man is insane. Watching troves of followers fawn over him is nauseating.

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[–]Anonymous73648839 69 points 18 days ago
I’m a little more concerned about his responses to those who bring up the negative Glassdoor reviews of the company, especially those who question Brandon’s nepotism with Riad, Riad’s attitudes towards other workers, as well as the sexual assault allegations. Basically his response is like ‘meh some people lie; I’ll arrange someone to go and film my workers and tell you how amazing the working environment is’.

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[–]MxUnicorn 101 points 18 days ago
All the sexual harassment claims are lies ❤️ people are just upset about not working for us anymore ❤️ - Brandon

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[–]lizzifer21 42 points 18 days ago
Is that a direct quote? Including the heart emojis? Unprofessional doesn't begin to describe that response! ��

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[–]queenofanavia 55 points 18 days ago
it is, he's responded to someone asking if the harassment allegations were lies with "yes <3"

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[–]pissliquors 15 points 17 days ago
!!!!!!!!!!! What the actual ****.

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[–]blackcats666 40 points 18 days ago
Yes ❤️

I was stunned when I saw that response. I can’t even put my thoughts into words about how not ok that is

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[–]skiptheglassdoor 25 points 18 days ago
He also tagged the "beautiful women" that worked for him and asked them to tell people how great it was

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[–]PhantaVal 11 points 17 days ago
To be fair, "beautiful" is his favorite word in the English language, and he uses it in just about every sentence.

But yeah, the tactic is skeezy.

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[–]millennialpinkfarts 30 points 18 days ago
Companies will only show you what they want to show you. The “transparency” is often just a marketing strategy. It makes it seem like he has done something bad/has something to cover up.

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[–]SummerNight888 30 points 18 days ago
And here he is again, discountinuing another line and letting his collaborator go on IG. https://www.instagram.com/p/Be1AyfGgdq2/?taken-by=deciem

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[–]ariehna plop dump tour de force 50 points 17 days ago
Our lovely customers who bought ESHO and hated it, please forgive me.

hated it

everyone hated it

This is getting to be some Tommy Wiseau **** here. Like I absolutely understand reaching that point of frustration with a product where you just throw up your hands and shout "IT'S BULLSHIT! AND EVERYONE HATES IT! just take all this money and get away from me with this TOTAL **** PRODUCT!" but geeze, dude. :)

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[–]PhantaVal 10 points 17 days ago
It kind of reminds me of Trump casually mentioning the "failing" New York Times or something.

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[–]kittymittons 6 points 17 days ago
What the **** is happening lol

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[–]ariehna plop dump tour de force 19 points 17 days ago
On the one side -- Brandon Axespray's personal Stendhal Syndrome!

On the other -- some day-old random spamming the same Brandon-hating copypasta across three subreddits!



i think glossier's behind it all

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[–]kittymittons 13 points 17 days ago
I think you’re onto something

illuminati confirmed

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[–]HumbleFrench 5 points 17 days ago
Your references to Tommy Wiseau and the Stendhal Syndrome are perfect. Thanks for the good laugh!

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[–]PhantaVal 24 points 18 days ago
I can't believe it -- now he's doubling down! How tactless is it to cut ties via IG and then to write openly about how many customers "hated" his collaborator's products?

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[–]SummerNight888 25 points 18 days ago
And to be admitting that the products were subpar, "rushed"?!? that's....disappointing to say the least.

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[–]HumbleFrench 4 points 17 days ago
Yup... I think the lip brand wasn’t the only thing they “rushed”. Time to use that 1 year return policy for some NIOD products...

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[–]SummerNight888 1 point 17 days ago
What else are you suspicious about?

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[–]HumbleFrench 13 points 17 days ago
Take Hydration Vaccine for example. It’s nothing but a combination of silicones with some (not so) fancy and useless ingredients. I wonder why I assumed it was a good idea to spend 40€ on vaseline... Same with their Survival line and the photography fluids... Not hard to find similar cruelty free products without the sciencey coating for cheaper.

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[–]SummerNight888 9 points 17 days ago
I never really understood the whole Niod line to start with, tbh... the concept behind is unclear, as with the products descriptions and what their ingredients do, it all looks experimental to me rather than factual. All topped with the high price tag off, it never managed to convince me enough to spend the money.

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[–]womblebum 1 point 17 days ago
I was looking forward to trying those as they had impressive claims. Definitely not now. I wonder what else he doesn't have confidence in.

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[–]VioletVenable 16 points 17 days ago
Yeesh, I hope that’s not actually how his collaborator found out…

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[–]SummerNight888 55 points 18 days ago
I'm perplexed. It's looking like it's turning out into Brandon's personal social media page, where he just posts all his shower thoughts.

I don't mind his transparency and reading about his plans/opinions/thoughts, but on the official business' page?! Mmmmh... I'm not sure that'll work out. Many people seem not to mind reading the comments, but maybe I'm old school, I prefer the brand page to be professional and talking about their products only. Brandon's personal videos (where he even gives directives to his employees!) are better suited to his personal account.

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[–]lhmccartney 10 points 18 days ago
Agreed! Glad I’m not the only one who has noticed this bizarreness!

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[–]lesmisfan12 25 points 18 days ago
According to his last post he's building a social media team since his posts have gotten such a bad response... and going on about some special soap. Jfc.

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[–]PhantaVal 11 points 17 days ago
His restraint didn't last. He promptly posted some bullshit backhanded apology for cutting ties with a business partner.

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[–]lesmisfan12 7 points 17 days ago
Saw that. This makes me not want to buy from Deciem anymore... sucks, because their niacinamide is my HG for that price point :/

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[–]Lechateau 1 point 16 days ago
Stratia rewind has all the goodies, not too much of a different price.

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[–]AngelachasedIG: @einepriseglitzer 19 points 18 days ago*
It's so strange but some people seem to really like his approach. One eco-friendly and cruelty-free fashion youtuber I follow on IG was literally in love with his posts and called Deciem's behaviour as a company remarkable. I can't take it seriously, especially with all the Glassdoor experiences...

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[–]womblebum 10 points 17 days ago
Apparently not tempering your words and being unprofessional on Instagram is transparent and authentic now. It's a cult of personality imo.

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[–]vocaltest88 15 points 18 days ago
Sorry if this has been posted but this is on their website...

http://deciem.com/founder

Edited to add: it may have been there already, but headline ‘the founder is screwed up’ is very strange.

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[–]starry101 15 points 18 days ago
If you Google "screwed up" and Deciem you actually find a lot of articles calling them a "screwed up" company. Mostly because they don't follow traditional business models. I don't think it was meant to call the founder a "screw up" in a negative way.

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[–]vocaltest88 7 points 18 days ago
Ahh fair enough. Tbh I thought it might be unrelated but hey!

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[–]motherfunctions 28 points 18 days ago
I live in Toronto where their HQ is and was curious about working there so looked at the glassdoor... it makes me never want to buy from them again. so ****ed up, I hope he gets ousted

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[–]wormspoor 30 points 18 days ago
It's ****ing weird and makes me not trust him. I mean, I don't trust any brand when they act like they're trying to be your friend, because business is business. But when they try hard like that it makes me think "what are they trying to pull?" idk maybe I'm just too cynical.

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[–]roxrae 13 points 18 days ago
This guy has lost his mind. He's gone off the rails posting stuff.

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[–]starry101 12 points 17 days ago
If you try to check out on their website right now you get "We are currently performing some maintenance on our servers. All payment functionality is temporarilly suspended. We apologize for the inconvenience. Please come at a later time."

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[–]calicovirus 28 points 18 days ago
Yeeeeeah it's bizarre as ****. It definitely turns me off the company, which is sad because there was a lot (on the surface) that I really liked about them - CF, affordable, giving percentages, Toronto-based, etc. On the other hand I should have known - I've never met a southern Ontario-based Brandon that wasn't at least a little bit of a terrible person...

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[–]Notthesame2016 49 points 18 days ago
Bah, the entire brand, Brandon included, creep me out with their monkeys and fake cuteness, pseudoscience and overconsumeristic cult. Their products are neither revolutionary nor high quality, and they have developed some fanatical following that keep encouraging their megalomaniac self image. Rant over.

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[–]AdAnimalibusAlmaMea 31 points 18 days ago
I also don't like what the founder is doing and him keeping TO out of stock to make people think the brand is more famous and bought than it really is, but I aknowledge that they have high quality products, based on science and reasonably priced. Is your hate for Brandon clouding your judgment of the products?

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[–]anysize 26 points 18 days ago
I’ve worked with more than one chemist who thinks The Ordinary is crap.

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[–]shireengrune 36 points 18 days ago
Could you explain why (or ask your chemist friends/coworkers to do so)? I think it'd be useful to know, since most people I've seen using it present the brand as some kind of Holy Grail...

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[–]ariehna plop dump tour de force 38 points 18 days ago
See, I'd absolutely understand if they were saying that about the NIOD line's more uh, eccentric offerings. I mean, "The journey of NIOD's yešti formulations is not one of a lower standard — it is instead one that allows our collective past an overdue chance to speak." -- ffs, dude :) Some of the copy for this stuff is ridiculous, and I say that as a daily user of several Niod products.

But TO seemed like a collection of pretty straightforward, single-purpose products

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[–]shireengrune 10 points 17 days ago
But TO seemed like a collection of pretty straightforward, single-purpose products

Well, yeah, that's exactly what they are. I use a couple and they are pretty straightforward, single-purpose, average-quality products that are decently priced. Nothing groundbreaking, but nothing awful about them either from what I saw.

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[–]ariehna plop dump tour de force 26 points 18 days ago
Did they explain what was actually wrong with it? I've absolutely heard critiques before, but they were almost uniformly along the lines of "You get what you paid for, but this tightly-focused solution isn't actually a complete solution; you'll need to compliment it with some other stuff."

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[–]AdAnimalibusAlmaMea 34 points 18 days ago
Ok, but tell me why. If you just say that some chemists think it's crap, I can say that some chemists say the products are good.

I hate all the stuff Brandon has been pulling and I won't buy from Deciem again after reading all about how sexist, racist and a piece of crap boss he is. But TO products are pretty good, they're just products that you can't use alone, like a Paula's Choice one f.ex, you need to combine them. And some Niod products are also good, despite all the crappy, sci-fi nonsense they use to describe their effects that I doubt they truly achieve all of them.

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[–]__looking_for_things 17 points 18 days ago
Not OP but I find TO's products really inelegant and not high quality. To me they feel like products that are cheap. It's subjective not objective of course and really depends on the customer.

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[–]AdAnimalibusAlmaMea 24 points 18 days ago
Yes, most the ordinary products are cosmetically inelegant (especially that vit C in silicone suspension. That's a horrible texture) but they do what they claim and for that price I'd rather them sacrifice texture than effectiveness. Now, Niod, the products I have from it are good but the descriptions of those........

It's a pity that Brandon turned out to be such a piece of crap, I won't be buying from Deciem again.

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[–]Notthesame2016 8 points 18 days ago
I've come in contact with the brand first, the owner second. I don't hate him, but I dislike the image they promote and their business practices. Their products are not high quality. Whatever they offer, you can get elsewhere for better quality, or there is absolutely no scientific research to back their claims. Some of the things they say are hilariously untrue and I don't know if it's ignorance or stupidity. And yes, I've tried multiple of their products and I find them mediocre, at best, extremely harmful, at worst.

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[–]shireengrune 10 points 17 days ago
Which ones do you find harmful?

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[–]Notthesame2016 5 points 17 days ago
The vit. suspension was the worst thing I've ever put on my face, closely followed by the retinoid. Gave me chemical burns, and I'm not the only one to happen to.

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[–]shireengrune 5 points 17 days ago
Oh, yes, the retinoids are fairly shitty! Heard that from several places, just forgot about it 'cause I was never interested in them :/ Sorry to hear that happened to you :/

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[–]ariehna plop dump tour de force 2 points 17 days ago
... I would really love to know if I am doing my skin harm with my use of one of their products. Which ones did you try?

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[–]Notthesame2016 5 points 17 days ago
Vitamin c suspension= chemical burn 2% retinoid= bone dry painful skin, rosacea flareup, did nothing Natural moisturizing factors= like putting butter on the face Niacinamide= useless, drying After that, I gave up. Now, keep in mind, I use low ph LAA serums almost continously. Right now, for exemple, I use the Wishtrend c 21.5 every day, sometimes on top of an acid, and I've never had issues with messing up my skin. Same for retinoids, I've used one form or another or more than 5 years, including various strengths of tretinoin and retinol, and I've never experienced more than normal flanking, but nothing like what happend the TO. I don't know what it is about thei products, if the formulation is messed up or what, but I can't tolerate them at all. If your skin reacts well to it, than that's good, I don't see any reason for worry. Plenty of people enjoy them. Keep in mind, though, that when you draw the line and calculate how much you spend in your products, it might not turn out to be that little.

Anyway, I personally find that I can get better formulated products than what they have to offer for not that much more money. And that I actually enjoy to use.

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[–]ariehna plop dump tour de force 1 point 17 days ago
Ugh, I'm so sorry about the burn! I'd be miserable too :/

And thank you so much for explaining. I was really surprised, because I've used TO's Hyaluronic and Retinoid for ages with great results. But -- I've always been a bit leery of any TO products that seem like they could be a bit rough on the skin; it's a bare-bones sort of line, yeah? So my feeling was that while they might work fine with a carrier or something (ultra-loose terminology here, sorry), I'd rather not apply them directly. There was never the chance I'd try anything which cited chance of a "tingling sensation" -- aside from Retinoid, which I'm used to working into a routine.

Totally with you on keeping an eye on costs, though. I wince every time I see folks with an assortment of some $70 worth of products -- which they're using in combination to approximate a $40 serum. At that point, why not just try one of the SubQ serums?

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[–]denewill 7 points 17 days ago
Their instagram had this certain aesthetic to it intially. Then its all brandon's face.

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[–]3404 18 points 18 days ago
He posted some more mouth-vomit again, I think he’s manic.

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[–]todaystartsnow 14 points 18 days ago
reading all of this is really putting a different spin the TO. i doubt i will make purchases from them. yes idk how other companies CEOs interact but the ones i do know, i can step away from the dumpster fire. no employee deserves to be treated so lowly. spending 8 - 10 hours of your day in a place you hate and are treated so poorly, its not right. and no, 5 dollar foundations doesnt make it right.

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[–]ChouettePants 5 points 17 days ago
More than anything else, I've tried real hard to give people the benefit of the doubt and try to frame their actions in the context of "maybe they're suffering". It's kind of cruel to make fun of someone having a mental breakdown, while his behaviour towards women if true is inexcusable.

Someone needs to convince this guy to see someone, you can tell he is messed up and suffering inside; the way he's begging for approval from his customer base.

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[–]llx94 8 points 17 days ago
Conspiracy theory: This is staged by the big brands in skin care who want Deciem to disappear and lead the buyers back to their products. These social media situations happened before in similar ways, so I don't really buy it anymore.

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[–]skiptheglassdoor 21 points 18 days ago*
https://www.glassdoor.ca/Overview/Working-at-DECIEM-EI_IE1054878.11,17.htm

Very negative work environment. Extremely superficial. If you are overweight, older than 35, a woman, and can't handle being discriminated then do NOT waste your time working here.

...

Animals in the zoo are treated better. No respect for employees. Expected to work morning until night. CEO communicates to his staff by using aggressive and discriminatory language to get the job done and outrageous profanities and you must be thin or you will be called fat on a daily basis. I really feel so sorry for the people still working there.

Advice to Management

Stop abusing and exploiting your staff

...

Owner yells, screams , throws fits. Gossips about prior employees in a demeaning manner. Expects employees to laugh along with his child like behavior, if you don't your gone. Tends to hire employees with temporary work visa's since he can get them for minimum wage. Don't apply if you are Canadian born, over 40 or married.

Advice to Management

Close your door if you are going to gossip about employees. Not cool.

...

Every negative comment on here is true and I experienced it for myself. I find it ironic how it's a beauty company and its' management is completely sexist and demeaning towards women. Please take the time to look at all the reviews... I find it funny how they tried to salvage the ratings by posting fake reviews back to back. Anyone with common sense can see that.

...

Every single review on here that describes the atrocious actions of the CEO are true. And you will notice that as soon as the truth is written in a review which highlights the shocking behavior of the CEO 4 positive reviews are posted almost instantly. He is a bully and nothing more. He spend his day discriminating people of color, female employees and anyone he basically decides he does not like. He screams and belittle's employees on a daily basis. I have seen him completely break people down with his screaming and bullying. He expects employees to work long hours for little pay.

...

-never received training

-owner frequently describes customers as "complainers"

-NO SAFETY practices at all, someone is going to get hurt -no culture -too much gossip and from the owner, doesn't really care to hide it. Has set the tone for the entire office -manipulative/immature coworkers (seemingly insecure as they can't stop insulting people that they pretend to be nice to) -High turnover rate is not surprising -Have experienced and witnessed sexual harassment/verbal abuse multiple times -HR gossips about employees to others, no confidentiality -owner can never stick to a deadline and disguises it as part of the whimsy of the company. From product releases to the opening of stores, to the move of a larger facility. Maybe he finds it comical that there are angry customers and frustrated, under valued employees. Maybe he just doesn't care. Also doesn't seem to want to enlist more experienced/established leads so that he can continue with "flat structure". Which is also disguised under the whimsy of the company. There's no respect, no one to be held accountable for anything. Some really great people have quit because of these reasons. -owner wants to make money, doesn't care about any of the employees at all -spends his time obssessing over the perfect instagram post for a product launch...but then...the product doesn't launch for months.

...

They were illegally paying all of their sales associates on an unreliable bi-monthly pay schedule when we were hired with a bi-weekly pay schedule in our contracts. There is at least 3 times during the year where employees go a month without pay based on this pay schedule. When brought to management and HR they refused to change it based on the difficulty it would take to do so.

...

This whole company is a sham. The only good thing about it is the products. Apart from that everything about management is ridiculous. From the way they handle interviews to blatant unfounded nepotism the way they run the company is out of hand on every account. People get promoted way too fast with no experience and no idea what they are doing and it shows in the poor way they handle everything. The company grew too fast for them to know what to do with it and they still don't know what to do with it and don't seem to be trying to figure it out.

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[–]evilkittiewe can do better. no mermaids 14 points 18 days ago
And all of the good reviews read like they were written by the same one or two people..

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[–]Toma_the_Wondercat -3 points 17 days ago
If even one sentence of this is true, where are the lawsuits for discrimination, unfair dismissal, bullying etc?? I call horseshit.

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[–]no_thank_u_plz 12 points 17 days ago
Actually, KindofStephen mentioned in his Insta story the other day that Brandon has been the subject of lawsuits in the past. So there’s a history there that’s probably starting to repeat itself.

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[–]nillbog 0 points 11 days ago
proof of this?

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[–]badgerm 3 points 14 days ago
What a trip that was.

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[–]enigma_pop 3 points 17 days ago
Glad I saw this before I placed my order! Nevermind on that.

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[–]Aleena_Perez 6 points 18 days ago
It seems completely normal to me because I've gotten used to how indie brands interact. It's made me hate most of what's in sephora that much more.
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Marina said:
Yes, I saw it, and it was in one of the links I posted earlier in one of the deciem/niod threads, I now cant't remember which one.
I'll see if I can find it. It was on racket I think.
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yes, I read all the articles,
it was this, you said, that I couldn't figure out how you got to it, your quote : Brandon is just a business entrepreneur, only in 2012 he had a graphic design company and now he is a skincare guru all over sudden. What he did, he invested his money in deciem and let the chemists to do their work. I'm sure he is going to apply himself elsewhere once deciem is in ruins.
 
lilith said:
yes, I read all the articles,
it was this, you said, that I couldn't figure out how you got to it, your quote : Brandon is just a business entrepreneur, only in 2012 he had a graphic design company and now he is a skincare guru all over sudden. What he did, he invested his money in deciem and let the chemists to do their work. I'm sure he is going to apply himself elsewhere once deciem is in ruins.
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It was a design company and someone was applying as a graphic designer with deciem I got it a bit mixed up, but Brandon is still an entrepreneur in my eyes after reading the above.

WillGrahamsLiver 88 points 18 days ago
I’m a graphic designer. Back in 2012 I lost my job and went with an agency to try to find work. The only position that agency pulled up for me was for a start-up called Deciem. The only info he gave me was that it was a very small team and the CEO Brandon was very passionate, quirky but at the same time spontaneous, all over the place and unpredictable. At the time I noticed that Deciem was the parent brand for all these other brands, which at the time had NOTHING to do with beauty. It was more for clothing, accessories some photography services etc. The selection seemed random.

After the agency interview, I found the Glassdoor reviews and decided to opt out of the real interview with Brandon and his team because I wasn’t looking for graphic design slave labour.

It surprised me very much when Deciem turned up in the beauty world and I avoided the products thinking, how good could they actually be? Back in 2012 there was no indication that Brandon was into all the science-y stuff that The Ordinary and NIOD spouts, let alone beauty in general.

That being said, I do like products from The Ordinary and NIOD but I might have to unfollow if their Insta is going to turn into the altar of Brandon.

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[–]calicovirus 37 points 18 days ago*
Interesting you say 2012. I was working not too far away from their Richmond St HQ in 2011 and I remember seeing their HQ, because I drove past it every morning for a couple of months and it was so ~mysterious, with that clock sign and everything. I had it marked off in my brain as a photography/design place. And yet their own website says they were founded in 2013. So strange...

edit: So I was still curious about this and I went to check on LinkedIn. Brandon Truaxe's profile says that Deciem was founded in March 2012 on there. It seems though that he discounts whatever they were doing in 2012 in more official versions of the history. Bizarre.
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