Ophelia

[Deleted member 21838]

A nice enough girl I assume, but like many younger people in general in this country - a blank canvas in terms of not knowing what you should know - thanks mainly to the failings of the UK education system over decades.

She does, in fairness, seem more confident in herself, but because of the much suffered empty vessel syndrome, so many of her contemporaries are also plagued by, she and they simply can’t string a coherent sentence together or have a decent backed up by life experience opinion on anything of some intellectual substance. Essentially, if it didn’t happen in their lunch…lifetime, or doesn’t affect them directly, they don’t feel they need to know anything about it. It is an indictment in 2023 that unless you are a twenty something and have been to public school, you tend to still have the vocabulary of a twelve year old. She, sadly, is no different. Blame the schools working class kids from big cities are sent to, not the kids themselves.

 

[Grizelda]

I can't so please tell all.

Most of them are very tall, thin and young. Sometimes you will see an average weight woman, but still very tall. Never an XL size, though. Nobody like our Claire. The models sometimes pose by bookshelves, selecting something to read, or drape themselves across furnishings. Very theatrical. They have impossibly thick, long hair, tons of makeup and they never smile, but give the camera alluring looks. The presenters are mostly young, blond women who prattle on at great speed and talk over the BA's. They seem to be excited by everything and they don't last long. Always someone new. Sometimes, a BA from Nina Leonard is on. Their words are translated into Italian. Very amusing. The fashions are usually quite glamorous, suitable for special occasions, unlike those shown in UK. I think Italians would find British clothes frumpy in comparison.

 

[User 27140]

A nice enough girl I assume, but like many younger people in general in this country - a blank canvas in terms of not knowing what you should know - thanks mainly to the failings of the UK education system over decades.

She does, in fairness, seem more confident in herself, but because of the much suffered empty vessel syndrome, so many of her contemporaries are also plagued by, she and they simply can’t string a coherent sentence together or have a decent backed up by life experience opinion on anything of some intellectual substance. Essentially, if it didn’t happen in their lunch…lifetime, or doesn’t affect them directly, they don’t feel they need to know anything about it. It is an indictment in 2023 that unless you are a twenty something and have been to public school, you tend to still have the vocabulary of a twelve year old. She, sadly, is no different. Blame the schools working class kids from big cities are sent to, not the kids themselves.

As an secondary English teacher of 35 years, I just want to defend myself and my colleagues. The curriculum is set by the government. Up to 2015, we used to teach spoken English and it was worth at least 20 percent of the final GCSE English Language. An important component was using Standard English and developing a wide vocabulary in order to articulate complex ideas. However, Mr Gove after listening to the complaints of Big Business, including the CEO of Tesco, rewrote the English Language GCSE curriculum to remove the role of spoken English. It was limited to one talk to an audience and worth 0%. The teaching time was spent on the reading and writing components worth 100% and spoken English was regulated to two lessons in a two year course in order to achieve a pass. In addition, with many families needing both parents to work, there are less opportunities to discuss topics which require a wider vocabulary than, "what is for dinner?" With the rise in streaming channels and social media, less families are sat together watching the same programmes, again limiting the opportunities for discussing more complex ideas and developing their vocabulary.
I am not making excuses, just stating my reality and experience. The value of spoken language needs to be recognised, in my opinion.

 

[ERICS MUM]

Give me Ophelia over Chloe Everton any day. Possibly over Simon Biagi too especially if he’s on with guests. Both have years of experience in telly / the meed-ja yet I find them cringeworthy.

 

[headintheclouds]

As an secondary English teacher of 35 years, I just want to defend myself and my colleagues. The curriculum is set by the government. Up to 2015, we used to teach spoken English and it was worth at least 20 percent of the final GCSE English Language. An important component was using Standard English and developing a wide vocabulary in order to articulate complex ideas. However, Mr Gove after listening to the complaints of Big Business, including the CEO of Tesco, rewrote the English Language GCSE curriculum to remove the role of spoken English. It was limited to one talk to an audience and worth 0%. The teaching time was spent on the reading and writing components worth 100% and spoken English was regulated to two lessons in a two year course in order to achieve a pass. In addition, with many families needing both parents to work, there are less opportunities to discuss topics which require a wider vocabulary than, "what is for dinner?" With the rise in streaming channels and social media, less families are sat together watching the same programmes, again limiting the opportunities for discussing more complex ideas and developing their vocabulary.
I am not making excuses, just stating my reality and experience. The value of spoken language needs to be recognised, in my opinion.

Wow, Futility58 - I had a broad understanding of how the English Language curriculum had shifted under our present government but your personal insight makes for sobering reading. I was blessed to have parents who encouraged the joy of reading, writing and active conversation from a very early age. I went on to study English at university and the love of language in all its forms has never left me.
I’m chiming in on the subject of Ophelia as I recorded an hour she presented (Nurse Jamie beauty tools) which I have on in the background at the moment... How is it possible to talk so much yet say nothing?! Her delivery is bizarrely staccato (”I advise you to. Get. Them. Home”) and her over-exaggeration and word-emphasis make my jaw clench (”This is PHENOMENAL. ALSO”) - aaarrgghhh! It‘s the same stock phrases over and over and an uncomfortable example of someone bluffing their way through a presentation with very little product knowledge.
And as if that wasn’t bad enough, her presentation’s just been ‘interrupted’ by Jill Franks demonstrating the ‘Supersize of the Munff’ (in Ophelia’s words!). Jill Frank’s another one I can’t bear - what a load of old codswallop she talks!
Thank goodness for this Forum - where else could we have a good old rant about this infuriating lot?!

 

[ERICS MUM]

As an secondary English teacher of 35 years, I just want to defend myself and my colleagues. The curriculum is set by the government. Up to 2015, we used to teach spoken English and it was worth at least 20 percent of the final GCSE English Language. An important component was using Standard English and developing a wide vocabulary in order to articulate complex ideas. However, Mr Gove after listening to the complaints of Big Business, including the CEO of Tesco, rewrote the English Language GCSE curriculum to remove the role of spoken English. It was limited to one talk to an audience and worth 0%. The teaching time was spent on the reading and writing components worth 100% and spoken English was regulated to two lessons in a two year course in order to achieve a pass. In addition, with many families needing both parents to work, there are less opportunities to discuss topics which require a wider vocabulary than, "what is for dinner?" With the rise in streaming channels and social media, less families are sat together watching the same programmes, again limiting the opportunities for discussing more complex ideas and developing their vocabulary.
I am not making excuses, just stating my reality and experience. The value of spoken language needs to be recognised, in my opinion.

This is a long one, apologies brevity is not one of my skills.

Totally agree. I’m 67 now so a dinosaur in terms of school lessons but at both primary and secondary schools we had to read out loud to an audience. I remember when I was 10 my class went to a local theatre to see an “age-appropriate” play. We had to write a review and mine was “chosen” I had to read it at assembly. So nervous.

More up to date at work, as soon as we reached a senior status in the company which involved speaking or making presentations to clients, we were sent on a public speaking course. We had to research, write and read a 15 minute speech on a subject given to us (mine was “The mal-distribution of the world’s wealth” ). Then we prepared/delivered 2 x 30 min presentations, one work related and another. I talked about picture framing and produced two I’d made. Another woman talked about making brownies and wrapped it up by handing out some she’d baked. We were critiqued by the tutor and other course attendees (quite forthrightly) video’d so we could look back for anything that might distract the audience. Waving hands, jangly jewellery, repeated licking of lips, umming & aaring etc.

It was a nerve-wracking course but boy we were professionals by the time we came through it !

 

[Deleted member 21838]

I went to a large north London, comprehensive school. 1200 boys, mainly from poor and working class backgrounds, and from places like Wood Green and Tottenham and Finsbury Park, with a small number of more middle class ones from the better parts of Crouch End and Muswell Hill. I was there from 1973 to 1979. Educational focus and school resources were geared very much to the upper stream allowed to take the then ‘O’ Levels route. They got the better teachers and much more commitment to educate them, because it was felt I suppose, that they best represented the path to succeed and to get university places ultimately for the benefit of school stats.

For us, in the middle stream (the CSE one), we did get the better teachers, but on a bad day, and one particular one who was driven and focused for the upper stream, used to regularly call us ‘basketballs’, do the pools during lesson time, would regularly tell us that we would never amount to anything, and to just do what we like during the lesson. I had a strong flair for languages and was very good at French up until year three, but because I was in the middle stream, the option to do French was taken away from me and I was forced to do the half-baked, **** & bull subject of European Studies, which gained me absolutely nothing.

I can honestly say that it is thanks to my mother that I have become relatively articulate, and not to the education system. My mother taught me to read, and as a well spoken, educated woman, was able to speak to me about the subjects in the world that everybody should be interested in. Yes, I did have some good teachers along the way, but educationally, I gained little to nothing from going to school, other than complying legally with the rules. and this was 50 or so years ago now, and the majority, who went to the poorer inner city state schools were being badly educated even then, and taught the bare minimum to get by in the world. I strongly suspect that little has changed - except we don’t learn things by repetition any longer, one of the few things, the educational system helped me to remember when I was at school.

 

[merryone]

Were in a world full of reality tv, fake nails, plastic surgery, fake tan, fake everything, and it doesn't matter if you can't string a sentence together, if you look the part you're in. I'm not saying we should be going back to the days where you'd never hear a regional accent on television, but somewhere in between would be better. I recently saw an advert on tv for a show that appears to involve "swinging" (partner swapping) It would not surprise me to see live dogging on telly next! I'm not sure what this has got to do with Ophelia, but it seems to me as long as you look good, it really doesn't matter what's going on upstairs!

 

[User 27140]

I went to a large north London, comprehensive school. 1200 boys, mainly from poor and working class backgrounds, and from places like Wood Green and Tottenham and Finsbury Park, with a small number of more middle class ones from the better parts of Crouch End and Muswell Hill. I was there from 1973 to 1979. Educational focus and school resources were geared very much to the upper stream allowed to take the then ‘O’ Levels route. They got the better teachers and much more commitment to educate them, because it was felt I suppose, that they best represented the path to succeed and to get university places ultimately for the benefit of school stats.

For us, in the middle stream (the CSE one), we did get the better teachers, but on a bad day, and one particular one who was driven and focused for the upper stream, used to regularly call us ‘basketballs’, do the pools during lesson time, would regularly tell us that we would never amount to anything, and to just do what we like during the lesson. I had a strong flair for languages and was very good at French up until year three, but because I was in the middle stream, the option to do French was taken away from me and I was forced to do the half-baked, **** & bull subject of European Studies, which gained me absolutely nothing.

I can honestly say that it is thanks to my mother that I have become relatively articulate, and not to the education system. My mother taught me to read, and as a well spoken, educated woman, was able to speak to me about the subjects in the world that everybody should be interested in. Yes, I did have some good teachers along the way, but educationally, I gained little to nothing from going to school, other than complying legally with the rules. and this was 50 or so years ago now, and the majority, who went to the poorer inner city state schools were being badly educated even then, and taught the bare minimum to get by in the world. I strongly suspect that little has changed - except we don’t learn things by repetition any longer, one of the few things, the educational system helped me to remember when I was at school.

Repetition of facts is very much the ”new” methods of teaching knowledge at the moment. I agree for many, parents are the first and best teachers. I am sorry you gained little from school but I did.

 

[boffy]

I cant for the life of me work out why Ophelia's command of the English language is so bad. Is it poor education? Who knows

 

[ArticMule]

This is a long one, apologies brevity is not one of my skills.

Totally agree. I’m 67 now so a dinosaur in terms of school lessons but at both primary and secondary schools we had to read out loud to an audience. I remember when I was 10 my class went to a local theatre to see an “age-appropriate” play. We had to write a review and mine was “chosen” I had to read it at assembly. So nervous.

More up to date at work, as soon as we reached a senior status in the company which involved speaking or making presentations to clients, we were sent on a public speaking course. We had to research, write and read a 15 minute speech on a subject given to us (mine was “The mal-distribution of the world’s wealth” ). Then we prepared/delivered 2 x 30 min presentations, one work related and another. I talked about picture framing and produced two I’d made. Another woman talked about making brownies and wrapped it up by handing out some she’d baked. We were critiqued by the tutor and other course attendees (quite forthrightly) video’d so we could look back for anything that might distract the audience. Waving hands, jangly jewellery, repeated licking of lips, umming & aaring etc.

It was a nerve-wracking course but boy we were professionals by the time we came through it !

I recall being put on one of those courses for a global company I worked for in a previous lifetime. One of my colleagues was a delightful French chap but he had the habit, whilst presenting, of having his hands behind his back and randomly bobbing down so he looked like he had frog legs. Most unfortunate and totally distracted me (at least) from his presentations.

 

[Grizelda]

For the life of me, I couldn't stand in front of a rack of clothes or an array of makeup/soap/face cream and talk about them for an hour. And then, maybe have to carry on for another hour. Charlie wastes a lot of time cracking jokes and Jill goes off at a tangent talking about herself. Jackie often giggles her way through her shift. Maybe Ophelia could pick up a few tips from them. She is deadly serious and if she lightened up a bit, she might be a better presenter.

 

[SisterBliss]

I was watching (silly me) when she used the word 'Knackered'. On TV.

Doe she even have a decent GCSE's in English?

GCSE. Ironic

I recall being put on one of those courses for a global company I worked for in a previous lifetime. One of my colleagues was a delightful French chap but he had the habit, whilst presenting, of having his hands behind his back and randomly bobbing down so he looked like he had frog legs. Most unfortunate and totally distracted me (at least) from his presentations.

Perhaps he has a wedgie.

 

[merryone]

For the life of me, I couldn't stand in front of a rack of clothes or an array of makeup/soap/face cream and talk about them for an hour. And then, maybe have to carry on for another hour. Charlie wastes a lot of time cracking jokes and Jill goes off at a tangent talking about herself. Jackie often giggles her way through her shift. Maybe Ophelia could pick up a few tips from them. She is deadly serious and if she lightened up a bit, she might be a better presenter.

I said this quite a lot when we used to compare Annaliese and her ott behaviour and Ophelia being like a rabbit caught in the headlights. I presume that they just had to tell Annaliese to rein it in a bit, and when she did, lo and behold we were left with a pretty good presenter. What do you say to someone who hasn't got a discernible personality and is making mistakes. They can address the mistakes and help her build confidence, but you can't do a lot about a lack of personality or originality. She might come into her own eventually, but we've waited an awful long time for her to reach the standard she's at now, so I'm not holding my breath. However, imo I'd rather watch a dull presenter than an annoying one!

 

[boffy]

Give me Ophelia over Chloe Everton any day. Possibly over Simon Biagi too especially if he’s on with guests. Both have years of experience in telly / the meed-ja yet I find them cringeworthy.

I have to say your spot on regarding Simon Biagi. He is one of the worse presenters on British TV. I absolutely cant stand his stock phrases that he has been using for what seems to be a lifetime. He chatters away nineteen to the dozen about nothing of any relevance. His poor presenter skill Trophy is shared with poor Ophelia who has low grade English speaking skills. Her Vocabulary is very very basic.

 

[merryone]

I went to a large north London, comprehensive school. 1200 boys, mainly from poor and working class backgrounds, and from places like Wood Green and Tottenham and Finsbury Park, with a small number of more middle class ones from the better parts of Crouch End and Muswell Hill. I was there from 1973 to 1979. Educational focus and school resources were geared very much to the upper stream allowed to take the then ‘O’ Levels route. They got the better teachers and much more commitment to educate them, because it was felt I suppose, that they best represented the path to succeed and to get university places ultimately for the benefit of school stats.

For us, in the middle stream (the CSE one), we did get the better teachers, but on a bad day, and one particular one who was driven and focused for the upper stream, used to regularly call us ‘basketballs’, do the pools during lesson time, would regularly tell us that we would never amount to anything, and to just do what we like during the lesson. I had a strong flair for languages and was very good at French up until year three, but because I was in the middle stream, the option to do French was taken away from me and I was forced to do the half-baked, **** & bull subject of European Studies, which gained me absolutely nothing.

I can honestly say that it is thanks to my mother that I have become relatively articulate, and not to the education system. My mother taught me to read, and as a well spoken, educated woman, was able to speak to me about the subjects in the world that everybody should be interested in. Yes, I did have some good teachers along the way, but educationally, I gained little to nothing from going to school, other than complying legally with the rules. and this was 50 or so years ago now, and the majority, who went to the poorer inner city state schools were being badly educated even then, and taught the bare minimum to get by in the world. I strongly suspect that little has changed - except we don’t learn things by repetition any longer, one of the few things, the educational system helped me to remember when I was at school.

I was very much in the middle stream for all my subjects, down for CSE and had to pay £3 to double enter at O Level which I passed with a C which was ok considering I was in a CSE class for the entirety of my time at that school . I achieved a CSE grade 1 at French which is supposed to be the equivalent of an O Level pass, but tbh it wasn't really recognised as such outside of the education system. Passed Art O level with a B, the rest of my results were pretty mediocre. Now I used to mess about terribly in class and my History teacher told me that if I messed around any more that I'd be put down into the remedial class (yes, that was a thing back in the late 70's). I didn't believe he'd do this for a second, so I carried on, and he said nothing until the next lesson he told me to go and join Mr Yates's class. I was horrified to have to join the "dumbo" class as we used to call them, but the standard of teaching was above and beyond anything I'd ever experienced and after a few weeks and an end of term exam I was sent up to a class in a higher stream than I started, I did really well in my mock, but I gave it up for Sociology/Geography - I still ask myself why. Hey, I can string a sentence together!

 

[missbabs]

Were in a world full of reality tv, fake nails, plastic surgery, fake tan, fake everything, and it doesn't matter if you can't string a sentence together, if you look the part you're in. I'm not saying we should be going back to the days where you'd never hear a regional accent on television, but somewhere in between would be better. I recently saw an advert on tv for a show that appears to involve "swinging" (partner swapping) It would not surprise me to see live dogging on telly next! I'm not sure what this has got to do with Ophelia, but it seems to me as long as you look good, it really doesn't matter what's going on upstairs!

If that's looking good I'd hate to see it on a bad day

 

[puffin48]

OMG. just caught a bit of Ophelia presenting the diamonique sale this morning with Hannah Clemmow. Poor Hannah can hardly get a word in edgeways and she is the expert. Does that woman ever stop talking over people. Hannah is very knowledgeable but she is finding it difficult to get her expertise across with Ophelia butting in. Have had to switch off cause it is really is a hard watch.

 

[merryone]

I caught a bit of Ophelia this morning and it was almost back to square one. I say almost as she didn't make any mistakes as far as I could see, but it was all "I'm lovin' it, your lovin' it" "£49 pounds and 50 Pee" Say the word pence for heaven's sake! Then at the end of the presentation I watched she dropped the last letter of nearly every word that she uttered. I don't care that she speaks with a Sarf London accent, but there's no need for sloppy diction!

 

[Anna]

I saw some of the Diamonique show too. It was pretty awful. I said to my OH, is she aware that some of the words she uses end in the letter g, and it is not shoppin, lovin, gettin, buyin, etc. I am far from perfect, but it made my teeth curl. I really cannot take to her presentation style, or rather lack of, and rather than wanting to see what is being shown, I just hear her limited vocabulary and get annoyed.