To spey or not to spey??

[Nikki]

I rescued a 3 year old maltese terrier, Pearl, as her then owners were going to sell her to the 1st buyer, likley to be a puppy farm as she hadn't been speyed. My vet tells me to spey her but it won't reduce her now increased risk of getting breast cancer according to him as she's had too many seasons. What it would do is stop nasty diseases potentially occuring later in her life to do with womb stuff. She's never had pups.

I'm so in 2 minds tho! When I got her she was very skinny, bald patches on her body, straggly fur. Now she's got a lovely muscle tone, she's bouncing about, loves life & walkies. Her fur is beautiful now, thick & healthy. Many have urged me not to spey her as when females are speyed later in life I've been told they can get fatter, more lethargic and generally older in their appearance & ways. The poor love has just discovered the young life she never had, I'd hate to take that away from her.

My other beloved shih-tzu who passed away before Pearl was also rescued from an unloving home but she was just a year old when I had her & was speyed at 18 months. Best move ever for her & she had none of these ageing probs but she was younger.

Any advice?? thanks x.

 

[Just Beauty Direct]

I'm no doggie expert Nikki, so can't give advice. But just wanted to say what a heartwarming story.so glad she has
Such a happy life now with you.

 

[SparklyBarbs]

Nikki i'm no help to you either, i always wanted a **** zu. Love them. You sound like a lovely person and this terrier is lucky to have you.
I've a cat, Hopey, and i got her speyed very early and i now regret it. I think it would have been kinder for her to have had one set of
kittens, and i feel bad i stopped that happening. Did it with the advice from everyone, but somehow i feel i did her out of something,
probably silly, but its how i feel. You have to decide if you can cope with puppies , but she'll love them and care for them and thats what
i regret letting Hopey have.

 

[kitten_with_claws]

Not having a bitch spayed doesn't automatically sentence them to a pyometra in middle age/later life but if it does occur, it can be potentially life threatening & the surgery is much higher risk than routinely spaying a bitch in good health. I have left several older bitches unspayed, not wishing to put an older animal through major surgery, (which carries its own inherent extra risk), once no longer being breeding candidates & never had a problem with a pyo but you never know, it's a bit of a lottery unfortunately.

Her age is fine for spaying, at 3 she is fully mature both mentally & physically; I am heartily against spaying very young bitches, seems to cause more problems that it prevents IMHO! Owners have to decide for themselves if they want to put their bitch through what is after all a major operation but fit, healthy bitches rarely have a problem of course.

Weight afterwards is not usually a problem if good, solid, regular exercise is maintained, along with a sensible diet & although you do get the odd one that develops bladder control problems after spaying, tiddling & dripping hither & thither, again, that really is only the odd one. Bear in mind of course that your vet's main consideration in pushing routine spaying is in the relieving you of a three figure sum, if pyos were that common they wouldn't say anything probably, emergency ops bringing in even more cash! lol

p.s I adore MTs, they are beyond adorable, cuter than a cute thing! lol

 

[Nikki]

Thanks so much for the advice, hugely appreciated! I wouldn't let him spey her when I first got her, just had a feeling she was far too underweight plus she needed time to get used to me & her new life. That on top would have been too much in every way for her. Just as welll as her periods were all over the place for a few months. I think she was kept in a cage/pen as her muscle tone was so poor. The owners never told me this of course but I could tell by the toilet training & the shape she was in. She also has a bit of a weak bladder, prob caused by her previous living conditions & I'm concerned that such an op could leave her with a degree of incontinence.

We did have a shih tzu once who had pyometra at 6 but she was an ex puppy farm breeding bitch. My ex saw her & paid for her to take her away before they bred her again. She was operated on relatively successfully but had very bad ongoing issues afterwards. The op saved her life but what the 1st owners did to her took it's toll on her little body.

I'm inclined not to spey Pearl as once the vets have their fees it's the owners who are left with any aftermath as a result of the op plus she's a different dog now. I'll post a before & after pic of her tomorrow. No one can believe the difference.

I think she's too small to have pups Barb, even by Maltese standards she's weeny. Plus I go into the office 2-3 days a week so eventho my lovely neighbours walk & play with her when I'm out I wouldn't want to not be here, I'd worry myself to bits lol. I'm on the look out for another shih tzu to keep her company tho now she's settled & learnt to run & play with other dogs. If it's meant to be the right doggie will come along, have to be careful as she's so small & she's had to learn about doggie behaviour herself x.

 

[SparklyBarbs]

Ah sounds like she's lucky to have you to look out for her. Different circumstances though i suppose, so its probably best to get her
speyed "sometime". You were right not to do it right away. Just keep doing what you're doing, giving her love and kindness, which is
all they need, cant understand people being cruel to animals, who can't complain.
Will look forward to the photos x

 

[kitten_with_claws]

Speak to your vet about your concerns Nikki, especially re. the incontinence issue, it's not automatic this will be worsened by spaying, it depends why they're incontinent in the first place.

I would not presume to tell anyone what they ought or ought not to do re. neutering, it's up to an individual owner but I would say that if it is something you are considering, either now or just at some point & you are also considering getting a second bitch, I would probably do the spaying first & give it time for it all to settle down, as bitches can be total barstewards if you change things that upset the pecking order, a zillion times worse than two males in many cases & anything that upsets the staus quo is best avoided IMHO!

(In which case spaying is sometimes a good idea anyway as you don't have them coming into season & potentially suddenly deciding to tear each other limb from limb & in my experience, once bitches start on each other it often tends to only get worse, not like males where they have a stonkin' great dust up & then get over it, bitches can form deep & lasting hatreds of each other & all the worst fights I have known have involved bitches, so something else to consider?)
:nod:

 

[Nikki]

Hmmm yes, that's why I wouldn't get another unless it was totally the right time if at all Kitten. I have heard about bitches fighting to the bitter end & being far worse than males. My other dogs have all been female shih tzus, had awful starts but never went for any other dogs, just wasn't in their nature at all. I've never had a maltese before. Some of them can be snappy according to my groomer but Pearlie does seem to be a little character. Loves looking at other dogs and copying them. She was anxious to begin with but with daily socialisation she's enjoying their company now. She also knows that my parents elderly shih tzu gent is the boss when he's around.

Her tiddling isn't bad in the sense that she does have control, she just likes to tinkle regularly. I did get her checked out to be sure but tests came back ok. I think given the state she was in when I got her she may have a slightly weaker bladder as a result of her start in life. I also had to fully toilet train her so she could be tinkling to show me that she knows what to do, (& get a treat lol) x.

 

[janie]

i've never had a dog of my own nikki but grew up with them. they were all females and all spayed. mum was adamant about it. they very rarely got out so it wasn't that she was worried about puppies. she was 'just' worried about womb issues in later life. maybe she had a dog that happened to, i'm not sure - one of the many questions i can't ask my mum now i wouldn't assume she can't have pups though? where there's a will, there's a way

can you ask your vet for advice? i have absolute faith and trust in my vet. i know he doesn't do things for money, only the good of the animal. with all the issues i've had with louis - and previous cats - i follow his advice to the letter. if i'm unsure about something, knowing he has a dog and a cat, i ask 'what would you do?'.

barbs - i wouldn't feel bad about hopey. she's none the wiser and although she would have loved and cared for her babies, mama cat soon gets fed up with them when they're grown then it's up to you to find owners who will also love and care for them - permanently. with so many unwanted kitties around, why add to the list? (((hugs)))

 

[madmax]

Deciding to bread from any bitch is a VERY BIG decision.
You have to make sure that both her and the stud dog are up to date with any health tests recommended for the breed, and not knowing much about her back ground do you know about her full medical history.
Then there is the cost's involved most stud dog owners charge the cost of one puppy so around £500-800 then there are the vets fees for care during the pregnancy and afterwards . Theses can run into £1,000 as I found out after Amber's last litter.
Then there is the hardest part of all finding GOOD homes for the puppies. I always turn away far more people than actually end up taking a puppy home with them.
On the plus side there is nothing more amazing than watching a litter of puppies growing into independent dogs who go on to give their new owners a life time if love and happiness.
I don't know if you ever saw the blog I kept of Amber's last litter if you want to take a look you can still find it at http://amberspuppies.blogspot.co.uk/.
I hope this has helped you to make the right decision for you and Pearl, don't be rushed into doing anything you aren't compleatly happy with. I am always will to give you any help and advice if I can.

 

[Nikki]

Amber & her pups pics are delightful! I love the one of the cat seriously checking up on one of the pups ahhhhh! Thank you, bought a big smile to my face! :sun:
& as promised here's Pearlie's before & after pics...

Skinny & sad at the start...


Getting more confident after her 1st clip & doing her "little hind legs dance"...




& now...


& her predessor, my beloved Millie, what a character, big paws to fill, but Pearl's doing well...


I would always urge anyone who'se considering a cat or doggie to get a rescue, either via a shelter or as I did, paying people to take them away from a life of pain & cruelty. They seem to know you saved them & give so much love in return xx.

 

[Frazzled]

She's beautiful Nikki, so was Millie.

 

[Mam]

Beautiful happy dogs Nikki. Thanks for sharing the pics.

 

[Nikki]

Thank you ladies! :sun: It's so nice to see them glow with humour & confidence after such a shitty, cruel start x.
The other pic came up as a thumbnail & missed half of Pearlie's face so I thought I'd post a couple with her face visible. All the orangey fur around her face has gone now too, she's become a right little diva, showing off to the boy dogs lol x.

 

[SparklyBarbs]

Ah Pearlie's really lovely. I'd love a wee dog if i wasn't working, very cute and much looked after and loved now.

I agree about rescue animals, but Hopey was bought from someone who had her locked in a room, and probably

cause of that she has cat flu, can never get rid of it, won;t kill her, just means she;s a dirty nose nearly all the

time, and i chase after her trying to clean it, as it blocks her nose. And my son's cat was a rescue one also, and

he was ill at the start, so i think you need to be careful, but both totally loved and spoilt now, and im glad you

rescued Pearlie xx

 

[kitten_with_claws]

Pearl is obviously a delightful (& very happy!) little thing & dear old Millie looked such a sweetie. xx

p.s. I love shih tzus as well.....not so keen on grooming them though although the ones I've had dealings with were all very well trained grooming wise, i.e. groom one half (while they snored peacefully!) then flip 'em over & do the other side, still snoring usually & only waking up when the topknot was going on! LOL

 

[Nikki]

Haha yes shih tzus are placid little souls usually. My Millie was a little bugger tho but always in a loving way. She'd nick stuff & hide it. Great fun watching everyone search the house, she'd get so excited bless her. Boy was she athletic too, olympian athletes would fall behind if she was chasing a cat lol.

My doggies tend to have puppy cuts as they enjoy rooting around under the hedges so pristine long coats just wouldn't work, plus Millie's was fluffy so just stuck out.

Barb, you & your son have done more than done your bit to save the little mites who had nothing too bless them. Like my mum says, these are the lucky ones :nod: xx

 

[donna255]

Ah, what a little cutie she is.

Okay, think about this. She will come into heat twice a year, and bleed. Think a period, some bitches bleed more than others. So sitting on your knee or on furniture she could leave stains etc. You will have to be careful when out walking her or letting her have run in the back garden or park. If you are happy you can manage this this then don't get her speyed.

 

[Nikki]

Thanks Donna, I don't give a stuff about the odd bit of staining, I have wooden floors & that's what cleaning solutions are for.
To hear the vet go on about pyometra, (womb disease, often life threatening in unspeyed bitches), it is scary. However females go through life not speyed & no issues at all. Then there's if I get another doggie at some stage, speyed is always best to prevent fighting so it's food for thought...x

 

[Weathergirl]

There are far too many unwanted kittens, the consequence of not neutering toms or speying queens. IMO in the bigger picture- whilst it may be a big op for her- you are doing a lot of good. You are obviously responsible to even be considering the issue on here. Sadly there are many people who because they either can't be bothered, can't afford or just don 't think who own cats, there will continue to be unwanted or abandoned kittens.

Neutering or Spaying is part of being a responsible pet owner IMO and those who can't afford to get it done should perhaps think twice before getting a cat.