Being totally UN-PC

[Totally Loopy Lou]

There’s a Storyville documentary on BBC iPlayer called “Petite Fille” (it is french with subtitles).

I would really recommend it as a great film and just really touching story but also gives such insight into someone going through this.

It’s about a very young french child who was born a boy but feels from even a young age, huge distress because he is not a boy but a girl - literally born in the “wrong body”...

The parents and family are very down to earth, very “normal” and you can see their pain at dealing with people’s attitudes to their child who just wants to dress as a girl and be treated as such. When really what difference does it make to them?
The mum especially is amazing - such love.... They face a huge hurdles.

I understand why and it IS so confusing for everyone especially when everything feels so fluid and undefined now. However, I can’t imagine how it must feel to be living in a body that feels so alien and wrong...

(I know this isn’t the same as men wearing makeup etc - which I do too find jarring and a bit odd but then I think well I guess they’re not doing any harm...?!

My bestest friend's grandchild was once her granddaughter but is now known as her grandson -ALTHOUGH she/he has only had the top bit 'sorted', and is reluctant to do downstairs.

So, tell me, because me and my friend can't get our heads around this. In reality the female bits downstairs are still there but the child - who is just over 20, is now dressing as a male, has a male haircut and taking hormones as well as choosing a male name, but is still theoretically a female. Its incredibly hard when speaking about this child, never knowing whether to refer as him or her !!!

The Human Rights Act really has a lot to answer for, as it has led to all sorts of 'rights' and in the process created a lot more confusion for the rest of us.

I don’t really see why it’s hard to know how to refer to the child? They were clearly unhappy living as their assigned gender and felt so strongly that they were willing to go through the process of taking hormones and dressing etc as a male, then they clearly identify as a man, use a male name and wish to live as a man, so just call them HIM!

I understand what you’re saying bc they’ve still got female genitalia but they obviously feel wrong living as a woman...

 

[Dame Fondacox]

I totally get that some people feel they have been born as the wrong gender and decide to undergo treatment to change it. However a man, who identifies as male, wearing mascara strikes me as odd.

 

[donna255]

For so many years it seemed to be men who had married and had children who seemed to suddenly decided to become female. The most famous the boxing promoter, Frank something.

Recently on BBC4, they reshowed a series from the 70s about someone who transgendered into a woman. I did not watch it now but remember sitting with my mum* and watching it way back. It followed the person over a number of years, they just never seemed happy and at one point tried suicide. Their doctor cut them off at one point as they went aboard to have the penis removed instead of waiting for the NHS doing which would have taken years. Finally caught up with them 10 years I think later? They had settled but never able to change their birth cert or passport to female.


*When I was a teenager, my mum and I used to watch all sorts of medical things, operations etc.

 

[Bettyboo]

Imo. Your gender is the one you were born with and no matter how you dress or what name you choose to be called. I would never refer to a person as they as it sounds so ****** ridiculous. This is my personal opinion and I don’t care what anyone else thinks.

 

[loveallthingsitalian]

I’m afraid the one section I can find no sympathy with are females who want to trans to men yet still want to give birth. If it’s so terrible living as a woman why would you want to go through the one and only thing which can still only be done by females

I’m sorry but a bearded person with boobs and a huge baby bump is repulsive.

 

[Grizelda]

One of the perennial problems for males who have become females is the voice. It is very difficult (some say impossible) for a man with even an average voice level to permanently speak in a higher pitch. Of course, she can be trained, but it will never be natural, and in times of stress, the lower pitch will erupt.

 

[Dame Fondacox]

Recently on BBC4, they reshowed a series from the 70s about someone who transgendered into a woman. I did not watch it now but remember sitting with my mum* and watching it way back. It followed the person over a number of years, they just never seemed happy and at one point tried suicide. Their doctor cut them off at one point as they went aboard to have the penis removed instead of waiting for the NHS doing which would have taken years. Finally caught up with them 10 years I think later? They had settled but never able to change their birth cert or passport to female.

Recently on BBC4, they reshowed a series from the 70s about someone who transgendered into a woman. I did not watch it now but remember sitting with my mum* and watching it way back. It followed the person over a number of years, they just never seemed happy and at one point tried suicide. Their doctor cut them off at one point as they went aboard to have the penis removed instead of waiting for the NHS doing which would have taken years. Finally caught up with them 10 years I think later? They had settled but never able to change their birth cert or passport to female.

I too remember watching that show and the reassignment surgery, which she fast-tracked to progress her relationship with her then parnter went wrong. Their relationship ended and she subsequently had quite a sad life - her second long-term partner ate breakfast one morning and walked out on her. She took part in Four In A Bed about 12 years ago, when she was running the Queen's Hotel in Benidorm and didn't portray herself in a very good light. Looking back at it now, you can see it was probably due to the underlying sadness and health issues. She died relatively young in 2019.

Julia Grant (transgender activist) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Totally Loopy Lou]

Link to the documentary I mentioned in case anyone wants to watch it...

It definitely made me think about my attitudes and opinions...

And I didn’t always find it easy to understand where Sasha was coming from, but also couldn’t get my head around some of the attitudes of others towards a young child who hadn’t chosen to feel that way...

Really nicely shot too!

BBC Four - Storyville, Petite Fille

A sensitive account of a year in the life of a seven-year-old girl assigned male at birth.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Brissles]

For so many years it seemed to be men who had married and had children who seemed to suddenly decided to become female. The most famous the boxing promoter, Frank something.

Recently on BBC4, they reshowed a series from the 70s about someone who transgendered into a woman. I did not watch it now but remember sitting with my mum* and watching it way back. It followed the person over a number of years, they just never seemed happy and at one point tried suicide. Their doctor cut them off at one point as they went aboard to have the penis removed instead of waiting for the NHS doing which would have taken years. Finally caught up with them 10 years I think later? They had settled but never able to change their birth cert or passport to female.


*When I was a teenager, my mum and I used to watch all sorts of medical things, operations etc.

Yes, Frank Warren aka Kellie Maloney imo tends to look like a pantomime character. He still has a the bullish male face, his makeup is put on with no finesse, and dont get me started on what his wigs looked like. Then of course like Grizelda mentioned - the voice. Change everything, but the male voice is difficult to disguise or change.

I remember watching The Danish Girl with Eddie Redmayne, this was the 1920s and he underwent assignment surgery, clearly a painful experience - for me as well !

 

[Mazza]

I watched that film, Petite Fille, and it was very good wasn’t it? I was won over by Sasha but you do wonder if some of these hormone therapies are started too early and then what happens if they change their minds? I read of a case here where the adolescent (if that even) started to change - and I can’t remember which way but girl to boy I think - and now regrets very bitterly what has happened and what might not be reversible. It’s a minefield.

Charing X hospital does a lot of sex change work and over various visits I was on the ward with a number of trans women who were still awaiting, or finally receiving, the voice box surgery, which I believe is the final part. Before that they are walking around in nighties but with booming voices.

On the genitalia front, I don’t want to be sharing female loos with someone who has a penis. That extends to gender neutral loos irrespective of any trans aspect!

 

[Twilight]

Did anyone else hear Marla Wynne once mention that when her children were very young she only dressed them in black clothing so that they could form their own identity later? She then said that her daughter now wears a lot of pink. It seemed so odd to hear it then but now 'odd' is all the rage. I prefer to be the 'odd-one-out'.

I don’t like black on a young child, time for that when starting school, when there are so many fabulous gender neutral colours to choose from. Even going to a funeral black is optional.

The only time my daughters wore black was when they put on their school shoes. I had one who was very girly & one who only wanted to wear jeans or jogging bottoms. Most of the time they wore blue & looking at photos it's clear to see their mum's love of sailor dresses!

 

[Vienna]

One of the perennial problems for males who have become females is the voice. It is very difficult (some say impossible) for a man with even an average voice level to permanently speak in a higher pitch. Of course, she can be trained, but it will never be natural, and in times of stress, the lower pitch will erupt.

The friend I mentioned earlier had much of her surgery in America and it seems surgeons over there have developed an operation on the vocal chords which alters the voice and making it sound more feminine. My friend actually considered it for a while but it has lots of risks involved including the rare chance of losing the ability to speak at all plus it costs mega bucks. She decided not to bother and when she talks I must admit even after all this time she still frequently sounds like a he, especially on the phone.

 

[Linwood]

The only time my daughters wore black was when they put on their school shoes. I had one who was very girly & one who only wanted to wear jeans or jogging bottoms. Most of the time they wore blue & looking at photos it's clear to see their mum's love of sailor dresses!

She, Marla, was saying that as babies/toddlers she dressed them in black so that SHE would not influence their gender/identity until they could make their own choices. Whatever, but perhaps it didn't do harm.

 

[stratobuddy]

There was a lot of discussion about this on one of the talk radio programmes in the early hours.

They had a was-man on who is now female, and said she KNEW she was supposed to be female from the age of 4.

Although she had had various operations, her voice was VERY low and male-sounding.

 

[Mazza]

Reading back I think I may have got confused and the last surgery is the Adam’s apple alteration, and not to do with the vocal cords.

 

[SisterBliss]

The son of one of my sister's friends has partially transitioned with hormone treatment only, has the pronoun they & decides on gender randomly. This person is one the most joyless individuals I've ever met & completely self obsessed.

I find the last bit is very common amongst the trans persons that I hav e seen on tv. Strangely it is mostly common amongst those transitioning male to female & not vice versa. Why can't people just be demure & mind their own business?

 

[stratobuddy]

Who's school photo is this?

 

[donna255]

Yes, Frank Warren aka Kellie Maloney imo tends to look like a pantomime character. He still has a the bullish male face, his makeup is put on with no finesse, and dont get me started on what his wigs looked like. Then of course like Grizelda mentioned - the voice. Change everything, but the male voice is difficult to disguise or change.

I remember watching The Danish Girl with Eddie Redmayne, this was the 1920s and he underwent assignment surgery, clearly a painful experience - for me as well !

Frank had plastic surgery that went wrong to make the face softer, more feminine.

The real Danish Girl died because they wanted a womb transplanted and their body rejected it.

 

[Clothescloth]

Who's school photo is this?


View attachment 22030

Jeremy Clarkson?

 

[stratobuddy]

Jeremy Clarkson?

Yes, I thought it was a girl, so ties in with this thread