Please listen Gemporia !

[user 17461]

The constant reference to 'legacy' and 'heirloom' for low priced items with treatments is my main issue with Gemporia, even MD Jake does it.When I started watching the channel I would have had little idea about the range of criteria that determines the price of a gemstone, so overselling the perceived value takes advantage of new customers in particular which is not ethical and surely misleading. I can't understand how Gemporia gets away with these tactics.

To be fair all the shopping telly channels are rarely open about stone treatments, unless they're marking something up for being natural.

Gemporia gives *some* codes in the on-screen graphics for gem treatments, with a vague key on their website. Though they hardly ever state on air that the codes are (partially) explained on their website. For diffusion, their website doesn't explain what this process actually means. I had to do an online search to find out that it's a glorified type of gem surface coating. And I am still unclear as to how stable this process is.

So if diffused gems get badly scratched or abraded, or indeed recut, you're going to see the real gem colour underneath. Hardly what I would class as a "legacy" stone.

 

[recoveringgemaholic]

“I would rather have one nice piece of jewellery instead of lots of pieces of not so move jewellery” so said by Ellis to Debbie Cavill when discussing one of her 3000 pound pieces. Apparently she doesn’t wear a lot of jewellery. Is this a rare bit of honesty or just sales tactics? To me this sounds like she only believes these high end pieces to be worthy of being worn by herself. She’s quite happy to sell the cheaper “tat” to everyone else isn’t she?
I also remember Lynn Jinks once used the word “tat” to describe the cheaper items they sell (this was pre destello when all they sold was jewellery). This was in the context of trying to build up a more considered purchase.
The lack of integrity is what I hate but then perhaps I expected too much of a business.
I feel like a total fool to have been taken in by them

 

[TheManWithNoName]

To be fair all the shopping telly channels are rarely open about stone treatments, unless they're marking something up for being natural.

Gemporia gives *some* codes in the on-screen graphics for gem treatments, with a vague key on their website. Though they hardly ever state on air that the codes are (partially) explained on their website. For diffusion, their website doesn't explain what this process actually means. I had to do an online search to find out that it's a glorified type of gem surface coating. And I am still unclear as to how stable this process is.

So if diffused gems get badly scratched or abraded, or indeed recut, you're going to see the real gem colour underneath. Hardly what I would class as a "legacy" stone.

I'm not a fan of diffusion treatment, I don't agree with it at because it's artificially adding a colour that isn't in the stone to begin with, however, I can confirm that it is not a surface coating.

Diffusion is a permanent treatment. Basically, the stone is heated to the point until its soft enough to add elements that give the stone an artificial colour - so, for example, Beryllium is added to Sapphire.

In the case of Andesine, the stone starts of as Yellow Labradorite, which then has its colour changed by the Diffusion method. Hence why many retailers refer to Andesine as Andesine-Labradorite, because Andesine is a very controversial stone in the trade.

So whilst it is a permanent treatment, it's adding something to the stone that wasn't originally there.

The downside to Diffusion treatment is that you can often notice where the added element hasn't applied the colour consistently. I've seen 'Andesine' that has lots of colour in 3/4 of the stone, but towards the very bottom, the colour is very patchy with, in a lot of cases, the original colour showing.

So in short, the treatment is as durable as the original stone - the only way of scratching a diffused sapphire is the same as an untreated / heated sapphire - with something 9 or above on the mohs scale.

The treatment that is surface treated is the treatment that shows as 'C' on air. That has a coating on the underside of the stone which gives the stone its colour. That's what makes things like 'Mystic' Topaz possible. This treatment can be very easy to scratch.

 

[Kit10]

Angeline smiles only with her mouth. Her eyes still glare.

Like the buyers, she talks down to viewers IMO. And I am not a fan of her barking at us to buy multiples.

I don't know if I would call any of the remaining presenters "sincere". My guess is that those who stayed are the ones who get the most sales, and are prepared to ramp it up now the crap has hit the fan.

You just have to see their reaction to the Bennetts' return. Before, they were behaving like everything in the garden was rosy. And Gemporia garden equipment and tatty home decor were beyond fabulous. And anyone lamenting the lack of affordable, decent jewellery shows were borderline evil.

Now it's "Hurrah! More jewellery wheels! Oh, how we've missed those!" So no, Gemporia is a sincerity-free zone

Oh, Vapidstoat, I could have written this myself! The thing that Angeline says that winds me up is ‘I’m going to make it easy for you to open your orders’? What exactly does that mean, other than buy this now and buy something else later. Yes no one was complaining about Colin when he was in charge, and they were doing well throughout Lockdown. Certainly not Katie and Hattie. I used to cringe every time they referred to him as Papa Colin…..

 

[TheManWithNoName]

I also remember Lynn Jinks once used the word “tat” to describe the cheaper items they sell (this was pre destello when all they sold was jewellery). This was in the context of trying to build up a more considered purchase.

Sadly, most of the current presenters do this tactic now.

When they're selling a diffused or irradiated stone, they'll not mention the treatment at all - they'll instead refer to the intensity of colour, the clarity or the carat weight of the stone, to hype it up.

Yet when they're selling the same stone in a Lorique ring, but in untreated form, they'll go into great detail about the stone being natural and how 'most Kunzites (as an example) are irradiated but this is completely natural", etc.

An irradiated Kunzite that they hyped in the morning for its "intense colour" and "great clarity" will suddenly become inferior by the afternoon when they're selling an untreated Kunzite, that is "superior in quality to irradiated stones that are available in the industry".

 

[TheManWithNoName]

Certainly not Katie and Hattie. I used to cringe every time they referred to him as Papa Colin…..

That'll be to play on the "Gemporia is like a family" image that they like to portray.

Yes, a family that is quite happy to get rid of presenters each time they need to make cuts to save money.

Nothing screams out "we're like family" better than making good, loyal, long term presenters redundant over keeping annoying newish presenters that shout "Absolutely" and "good luck to each and every one of you, well done" every thirty seconds......

 

[user 17461]

I'm not a fan of diffusion treatment, I don't agree with it at because it's artificially adding a colour that isn't in the stone to begin with, however, I can confirm that it is not a surface coating.

Diffusion is a permanent treatment. Basically, the stone is heated to the point until its soft enough to add elements that give the stone an artificial colour - so, for example, Beryllium is added to Sapphire.

In the case of Andesine, the stone starts of as Yellow Labradorite, which then has its colour changed by the Diffusion method. Hence why many retailers refer to Andesine as Andesine-Labradorite, because Andesine is a very controversial stone in the trade.

So whilst it is a permanent treatment, it's adding something to the stone that wasn't originally there.

The downside to Diffusion treatment is that you can often notice where the added element hasn't applied the colour consistently. I've seen 'Andesine' that has lots of colour in 3/4 of the stone, but towards the very bottom, the colour is very patchy with, in a lot of cases, the original colour showing.

So in short, the treatment is as durable as the original stone - the only way of scratching a diffused sapphire is the same as an untreated / heated sapphire - with something 9 or above on the mohs scale.

The treatment that is surface treated is the treatment that shows as 'C' on air. That has a coating on the underside of the stone which gives the stone its colour. That's what makes things like 'Mystic' Topaz possible. This treatment can be very easy to scratch.

The info I found online described diffusion as a surface treatment because it doesn't permeate the whole stone: it only changes the surface colour, and a tiny proportion of the stone beneath the surface. Which is also why I stated that recutting a diffused stone would show the original, real colour.

Thanks for stating that the colour change is permanent. I couldn't find that in my search.

And yes, I know the difference between the diffusion and coating codes. Is why I roll my eyes whenever a presenter waxes lyrical over the amazing colour of what turns out to be a coated gem. And also dyed ones

ETA: confusingly, I have now found a different site that states that while diffusion can be used to make shallow changes to gems, it can also be used to induce a colour change in the whole of a gem stone.

So I apologise for the confusion. Either way, Gemporia is very wrong to state that diffused sapphires are "legacy stones", with all that this implies.

 

[TheManWithNoName]

The info I found online described diffusion as a surface treatment because it doesn't permeate the whole stone: it only changes the surface colour, and a tiny proportion of the stone beneath the surface. Which is also why I stated that recutting a diffused stone would show the original, real colour.

Thanks for stating that the colour change is permanent. I couldn't find that in my search.

And yes, I know the difference between the diffusion and coating codes. Is why I roll my eyes whenever a presenter waxes lyrical over the amazing colour of what turns out to be a coated gem. And also dyed ones

ETA: confusingly, I have now found a different site that states that while diffusion can be used to make shallow changes to gems, it can also be used to induce a colour change in the whole of a gem stone.

So I apologise for the confusion. Either way, Gemporia is very wrong to state that diffused sapphires are "legacy stones", with all that this implies.

Don't worry - the whole treatment process throughout the entire industry is muddled and confusing. Hence why I believe the industry needs regulating.

Some companies deliberately word the explanation of treatments to be vague and misleading.

Some companies word the explanations incorrectly because they dont really understand them themselves because they're not gem experts - they're simple retailers that buy jewellery in, and then resell it at profit.

Then there are companies that 'cut and paste' treatment details from other online sources - but re-word in a way that bits are lost in translation to avoid plagiarism and / or they use AI software to generate or re-word a treatment description - and its either altered the description to a point where its reworded it to mean something completely different or the software is just plain wrong (which AI often is).

 

[TheManWithNoName]

'Waxing' is one treatment I'm particular that is described in many ways. Gemporia refer to Waxing as a "thin layer of wax on the surface of the stone to make it less porous" - but some other companies describe Waxing as adding wax and resin actually into the stone (which is also referred to as 'stabilisation').

It's a shambles. The industry needs regulation and 'uniformity' across the board to prevent all this confusion.

 

[Imogene9500]

The constant reference to 'legacy' and 'heirloom' for low priced items with treatments is my main issue with Gemporia, even MD Jake does it.When I started watching the channel I would have had little idea about the range of criteria that determines the price of a gemstone, so overselling the perceived value takes advantage of new customers in particular which is not ethical and surely misleading. I can't understand how Gemporia gets away with these tactics.

Just thinking about the sales strategy I am wondering if providing authentification certificates is actually a cover for some overselling, so more in the interests of the seller than consumer. There is no audit trail for what is said in auctions, but Gemporia can always fall back on the transparency in the authentication certs so it is clear if stones are filled etc albeit so called legacy in presentations? Sounding v cynical now but I rely on trust when I am buying and there is lots at present to make me question.

 

[user 17461]

Just thinking about the sales strategy I am wondering if providing authentification certificates is actually a cover for some overselling, so more in the interests of the seller than consumer. There is no audit trail for what is said in auctions, but Gemporia can always fall back on the transparency in the authentication certs so it is clear if stones are filled etc albeit so called legacy in presentations? Sounding v cynical now but I rely on trust when I am buying and there is lots at present to make me question.

Gemporia seems to employ smoke and mirrors in their presentations: the presenters will merrily use words like "legacy" and "heirloom" to describe gems and jewellery, with very little discussion of treatments. But the company can always bat away criticism by stating that treatment codes are listed in the on-screen graphics. Even if these aren't explained in full by the presenters or on the Gemporia website. If a viewer knows enough to go look there, of course.

It's up to the individual viewer to decide whether knowing the tricks that Gemporia pulls on a regular basis are a deal-breaker to buying. If I saw something inexpensive that I liked the look of, I might well buy it. But I wouldn't be under the impression that it would be worth anywhere near enough to be handed down through the family.

Knowing what Gemporia is OK with doing to generate sales means that I certainly don't trust them enough to spend significant amounts of money with them.

 

[Snowstorm]

Remember this is the one and only Ellis talking!!!

Yes she has become insufferable lately. I used to like her but her antics of late are incredibly annoying and patronising. She seems to think those that have a different view are to be discarded. She has become prickly and sadly now comes across as insincere.

 

[TheManWithNoName]

The two VERY misleading statements that really annoy me are these two:

"It's had a little bit of heat" when referring to heat treatment. This is misleading. A stone is either heat treated or it isn't. There's no in-between. A stone can't just be given a 'little bit of heat' - heat treatment involves heating a stone to extreme temperatures.

"Drenched in Gold" when talking about plated jewellery. The presenters have clearly been instructed to say this by management because it's not just one presenter saying it - it's most of them. It implies that the gold is thick because it's been "drenched" - but that isn't true.

First of all, "Gold-tone" contains NO gold. It simply means 'gold coloured'. This is usually achieved by combining metals such as copper and zinc to give it a 'gold' colour. This coating is very soft, thin and wears very quickly.

Gold-plating contains real gold - but 'plating' comes in various thicknesses of gold:

'Gold Flash' - this is the thinnest. It contains 0.175 microns of gold that has been electroplated onto the jewellery.
'Gold Plated' - this is the second thinnest. It contains 0.500 microns of gold that has been electroplated onto the jewellery.
'Gold Midas' - I'm not 100% sure on this one, but my understanding, to the best of my knowledge is that it sits in the middle at between 0.500 microns thick to 1.0 microns thick.
'Gold Vermeil' - This is the highest quality gold plating and it has to comply to certain standards. First of all, it must have Sterling Silver as the base metal. Then the gold that is applied MUST be AT LEAST 10k gold. However, the thickness of the 'Vermeil' varies depending on the country of origin. Canadian 'Vermeil' is around 1.0 microns thick - whereas in the USA, the minimum standard is at least 2.5 microns thick.

'Flash', 'Plated' and 'Midas', in my opinion, stand out a mile because they don't look gold - they look 'bright yellow', which gives jewellery a cheap and tacky look. I wouldn't touch them at all.

'Vermeil' does actually look like gold though. It offers the balance to those that don't want Silver, but can't afford Gold - so Vermeil gives a 'Gold' appearance at Silver prices.

 

[TheManWithNoName]

Yes she has become insufferable lately. I used to like her but her antics of late are incredibly annoying and patronising. She seems to think those that have a different view are to be discarded. She has become prickly and sadly now comes across as insincere.

I find her a bit patronising too because she talks to the screen like she's talking to children. I don't think it's intentional - I think she does it because she's naturally quite 'mumsy' - but that mannerism, combined with the singing and cheesy made up songs, just make me feel like I'm being spoken to as if I'm thick and childish.

 

[Snowstorm]

Enjoying the Jim n Dave show this afternoon.

 

[Rose de France]

'Gold Midas' - I'm not 100% sure on this one, but my understanding, to the best of my knowledge is that it sits in the middle at between 0.500 microns thick to 1.0 microns thick.

Once upon a time (spring 2020 - autumn 2021) there was a Polish-language TV channel called "Gemporia" (aired in Poland from the Gemporia's studio in the UK). The presenters always said that Midas = 3 layers of 18K gold. But I don't know exactly how thick it is.

 

[TheManWithNoName]

Once upon a time (spring 2020 - autumn 2021) there was a Polish-language TV channel called "Gemporia" (aired in Poland from the Gemporia's studio in the UK). The presenters always said that Midas = 3 layers of 18K gold. But I don't know exactly how thick it is.

That could well be true - if it's 3 layers of gold at 0.175 microns each ('Flash'), that makes it 0.525 microns thick in total, which takes it into the lower thickness end of the 'Midas' category.

The presenters say 'plated in 18k gold' to make it sound more expensive, but (and this is only my opinion), 9k gold would probably be more suitable for plating because it's harder. The purer gold is, the softer it is. As plating wears quicker because it's thin, then ideally, the plating needs to be as strong and as thick as possible to make it last.

Plated jewellery has no real worth - so I feel its morally wrong of them to imply that 3 layers of 18k gold is great because it's worth more. The layers are so thin that the gold is worth pennies.

 

[Kit10]

I don’t think Midas refers to anything other than a gold plated silver Collection, named after King Midas, whose touch turned everything to gold. Vermeil does have an industry standard, QVC used to have some beautiful collections, and occasionally TJC have some pieces of Vermeil.

 

[Imogene9500]

Gemporia seems to employ smoke and mirrors in their presentations: the presenters will merrily use words like "legacy" and "heirloom" to describe gems and jewellery, with very little discussion of treatments. But the company can always bat away criticism by stating that treatment codes are listed in the on-screen graphics. Even if these aren't explained in full by the presenters or on the Gemporia website. If a viewer knows enough to go look there, of course.

It's up to the individual viewer to decide whether knowing the tricks that Gemporia pulls on a regular basis are a deal-breaker to buying. If I saw something inexpensive that I liked the look of, I might well buy it. But I wouldn't be under the impression that it would be worth anywhere near enough to be handed down through the family.

Knowing what Gemporia is OK with doing to generate sales means that I certainly don't trust them enough to spend significant amounts of money with them.

Completely agree, I don't have much trust now in the brand Personally i have had some lovely pieces from Gemporia in the past, otherwise I would not even tune in at all, but the direction the company has gone in recently with its shouty presenters and Dave/Jake flogging the dream/legacy leaves me cold.More than anything I worry that potential new customers are being misled and feel sad that so many people may have spent considerable amounts thinking there is significant value in their purchases.

I don’t think Midas refers to anything other than a gold plated silver Collection, named after King Midas, whose touch turned everything to gold. Vermeil does have an industry standard, QVC used to have some beautiful collections, and occasionally TJC have some pieces of Vermeil.

I agree I think Midas is just gold plate with no particular standard attached. Gemporia has sold Vermeil in the past but not recently as far as I know.

 

[Carsc]

Is the base metal for gold plated, gold flash and Midas always silver ?